Hero power calculation – why does a 5* Hero with lower stats than a 4* Hero have a higher Card Power?

[bhushan]

How come Poseidon has higher power than chao even though chao has better stats on all fronts?

[Guvnor]

Cause he’s a 5* and Chao isn’t

[Guvnor]

In seriousness tho, I’m not sure… I guess the game is really designed to push people towards getting and levelling 5* heroes over 4* and 4* over 3* etc…

Thanks for the heads up tho, not something I’d ever looked into personally. Will be taking powers with a grain of salt now!

[JonahTheBard]

As you may know, we give a small bonus in the power based on the rarity of the hero. We do this to reflect the fact that the specials of the rarer heroes tend to be more powerful.

Quote from developer @mhalttu

[bhushan]

Thanks, but this is not just small bonus, they have 100 point difference in defense stats, and from what I understand, defense points counts for most among the 3 in power calculation.

[bhushan]

This explains it!

CP Calculation

Note: “CP” = Card Power I’ve worked out the exact CP formula. Each card has a base CP when stats are all 0. That value is: 1* Base CP: 0 2* Base CP: 10 3* Base CP: 30 4* Base CP: 50 5* Base CP: 90 Specials are worth 5 extra CP for each level after the first Talent tree nodes are worth a flat 5 CP each, and stat increases from talent tree nodes don’t have a direct effect on CP (so whether the node gives you 15 Attack or 45 Attack, it’s still 5 CP). See the discussion in posts below fo…

[nevarmaor]

True, but it’s also not a small difference in the power of their specials either.

596 * 4.5 = 2682
607 * 3.15 = 1912

But in general regardless of power rating a 4.70 4* > a 3.70 5*.

[Scarecrow]

Except for Seshat

[bhushan]

@nevarmaor

4.70 4* > a 3.70 5*.

It’s the other way around, but I get what you mean.

[nevarmaor]

I meant in terms of usage. And yes, there are exceptions. Frida too.

[Scarecrow]

It is not. A maxed 4* hero is better than a 3.70 legendary, that’s a fact. He said, “regardless of power rating”

[Scarecrow]

Btw, this is the main reason for a new player to work at 4* heroes in the first months. Comparing “twin” heroes, the epics are better: maxed Grimm > Isarnia 3…70, Kelile > Marjana 3.70, Triton > Poseidon, Colen > Azlar and so on… Besides, the 4* heroes may be emblemed and this is the greatest advantage upon 3.70 legendaries.

[nevarmaor]

That and the fact you can probably take two 4* from 1.1 to 4.70 in the time it takes to get a 5* from 4.1 to 4.80.

[lexinen]

This is one of the reasons why I completely ignore hero/team power numbers when analyzing a raid defense or offense. I would actually prefer that hero/team power be removed from the game entirely since those numbers only seem to cause confusion.

[Gryphonknight]

@nevarmaor

But in general regardless of power rating a 4.70 4* > a 3.70 5*.

I agree.

In General.

For base stats

@Gryphonknight

4* 4.70 > 5* 3.70

Grimm > Isarnia until:

Stat	Level
Attack	5* 4.29
Defense	5* 3.55 ( Grimm 4* 4.70 ( Defense 531 ) has a lower Defense Stat than Gunnar 3* 3.50 ( Defense 533 ) )
HP	5* 4.52

But some specials are worth it at 5* 3.70

@Gryphonknight

Mother North, Alberich, Delilah, Joon, Natalya, are some heroes that work fine at 5* 3.70 because of their special skills. They work better at 5* 4.80 or 5*+19 but fine at 5* 3.70 . When at 5* 3.70 they need a decent roster of 4* heroes to support them.

Click for discussion of 5* 2.60 and 3.70

So depending on your roster

@Noble_Weasel

Using that same principle, though, gives me justification to take Poseidon to 2^60 before leveling Kailani and Gan Ju. I’m in about equally bad shape for fighters, monks, and clerics (maybe worse on clerics, but Mneusses is my next green project). So if a 5-star 2^60 is better than a 3-star 3^50, Poseidon at 2^60 would be my second-best fighter class hero, only behind Valen because he is heavily emblemed. Plus, he’d be my third best available yellow unless I leveled a second Danzaburo, so he also builds war depth, even at 2^60.

Mostly I use hero power to quickly reroll in raids and to tell my multiple Rigard, Melendor, Grimm, Proteus, etc. apart ( see we can not give heroes nicknames or notes ).

[Rigs]

Rarity(hotm, s2, event, etc) and *(3,4,5) level are taken into account in the hero powers

A base level(1/1) 5* has higher power rating than a base level 4*

Well as both increase as they are leveled, the 5* stays higher than the 4* cause it had a higher start point

Hero power is typically how strong a hero is in comparison to other heroes at same * rating. Comparing a 3/70 poseidon to a 3/70 joon makes more sense than comparing a 4/70 chao to a 3/70 poseidon…(without getting into emblems and the mathematical break down of the hero power formula)

[Gryphonknight]

@Scarecrow

main reason for a new player to work at 4* heroes in the first months.

I agree.

Click if new player or more details

Food and Hero XP

In my opinion the main reason for 4* 4.70 is 5* 4.80 heroes take 3.84x food and 2.12x Hero XP ( in general when comparing 4* 4.70
versus 5* 4.80 ).

So 4x rainbow 4* 3.60 teams ( and then 2x rainbow 4* 4.70 teams) much more cost effective than 1x rainbow 5* 4.80 team when first starting in Empires.

@Gryphonknight

First 4* team
Part 2 ( linky, linky )

Missing

In my experience, the main reason for 5* 3.70 is special skill, color stacking, and lack of 4* hero that fits the same role in your roster.

Looking at you yellow 5* 3.70 Vivica / Joon ( yellow 4* heroes are a sorry bunch ).

Notes

Color stacking

Color stacking, Empires hidden buff

@Gryphonknight

Double strong color, no weak color, teams==

Now that you have two rainbow teams ( one 3* 3.50 and one 4* 3.60 ) you can create double strong color, no weak color teams.

If you are attacking a Green Boss, then Red heroes are better because they are strong against green, so Green bosses takes double damage. The opposite is true of Blue heroes. Blue heroes cause half damage to a Green boss. The other colors ( Green, Purple & Yellow ) do neutral damage or no increase or decrease in damage.

When attacking a Green boss, remove your BLUE 4* 3.60 hero ( half damage against Green ) from your rainbow 4* 3.60 team, and replace it with your RED 3* 3.50 hero ( double damage against Green ) for a double red, no blue team.

You will do 1 HP of damage with blue matches/ board damage, since you are missing a Blue hero. But your two Red heroes will do double damage. Even if your Red 3* 3.50 hero dies against a Green boss, twice its attack stat will still be added when doing matching/ board/ physical damage.

==Weird color teams==

Other teams:

triple strong color,
quadruple strong color,
double neutral color,
double neutral three color teams and
single color teams.

Once you have more experience with rainbow teams and double strong color, no weak color teams, you can learn more about these weird alternatives.

==Elemental shields or Reflect color enemies==

When you fight an enemy with an elemental shield, it is weak to a color, strong to a color and REFLECTS a color. Example: A Reflect green boss takes double damage from Red heroes, half damage from Blue heroes, and reflects all damage from Green heroes back to that hero. So a triple red, no blue, no green team OR a double red, double yellow/ double purple, no blue no green team works better than a rainbow team. Example you can remove your Blue 4* 3.60 and Green 4* 3.60 heroes and replace them with one Red 3* 3.50 hero and one Purple/ Yellow 3* 3.50 hero.

So having a rainbow 3* 3.50 and a rainbow 4* 3.60 lets you take on Reflect color enemies until you level up a second rainbow 3* 3.50, second rainbow 4* 3.60, etc.

[OnMyWayOut]

If you look at these 2 images, what do you think?

The Stats for Liana is much lower than Gaedeirus, but her power is just a little bit lower??? How come?

[Guvnor]

Not a Bug.

Best explanation into the Cost Power (CP) by @Garanwyn
CP Calculation - #15 by Garanwyn

@Garanwyn

I’ve worked out the exact CP formula.

Each card has a base CP when stats are all 0. That value is:

1* Base CP: 0
2* Base CP: 10
3* Base CP: 30
4* Base CP: 50
5* Base CP: 90

Specials are worth 5 extra CP for each level after the first

Talent tree nodes are worth a flat 5 CP each, and stat increases from talent tree nodes don’t have a direct effect on CP (so whether the node gives you 15 Attack or 45 Attack, it’s still 5 CP). See the discussion in posts below for the details.

The Full Formula

CP=(base CP for stars) + floor(attack * 0.35 + defense * 0.28 + health * 0.14) + (special level - 1) * 5 + (Talent tree nodes) * 5

Examples:

…

Discussion on exactly the same topic:

Hero power calculation – why does a 5* Hero with lower stats than a 4* Hero have a higher Card Power?

[image] [image] How come Poseidon has higher power than chao even though chao has better stats on all fronts?

Another thread which goes through “How to Calculate Team Power - Inc. Troops”

How to calculate team power, including troops!

Guided spreadsheet calculated including troop team power by level [IMG-20190905-WA0012] [IMG-20190905-WA0013]

[zephyr1]

Merged, thanks!