What Is Elemental Damage? - A Guide to Elements

[EvilSmoothie]

Yes it means exactly that.

[1Peterboy]

Good information thank you

[Papca]

@lexinen

Some attacks are considered non-elemental and do the same amount of damage to all elements. The following attacks are considered non-elemental:

• Special attacks by the player’s heroes.
• Both normal and special attacks by enemies (including enemy heroes and titans).
• Damage Over Time (DOT) effects like burn and poison.

Hi Lexinen, is it really as you write?
Does it mean that e.g. yellow titan does the same damage to yellow heroes as dark heroes?
Does it mean that defending team do not benefit from attacking with strong colour (normal attack as well special)?
Does it also mean that Evelyns of Jackals colour debuf does not work in defence?

Thank you for your reply.

[jinbatsu]

@Papca

Does it also mean that Evelyns of Jackals colour debuf does not work in defence?

Special attacks are non-elemental, unless elemental buffs/debuffs are involved or the specialskill has specific wording against a certain color, like Ursena, Gravemaker.
Jackal debuff + any normal or special from defender Yellow like Joon will not has advantage from jackal debuff.
But Jackal + Ursena this can be (but I’m not sure).

[lexinen]

@Papca

Does it mean that e.g. yellow titan does the same damage to yellow heroes as dark heroes?

Correct, assuming the heroes have similar defense stats.

@Papca

Does it mean that defending team do not benefit from attacking with strong colour (normal attack as well special)?

Also correct. This is one reason why rainbow teams are recommended for defense: color stacking doesn’t give the defender any extra attacking advantage, but rather it concentrates their elemental weakness to fewer colors and encourages the attacker to color stack their own teams to take advantage of that.

@Papca

Does it also mean that Evelyns of Jackals colour debuf does not work in defence?

Color debuffs do work since they are based on the source of the damage, not whether the attack itself is elemental or not. So if a defender fielded Jackal + Joon and they fired their specials in the right order at the same target, Joon’s attack would indeed deal extra damage due to Jackal’s holy defense debuff. That being said, the AI controlling the defense team generally can’t be counted on to pull off a strategy like that consistently, so it tends to be more useful for the player-controlled attacking team anyway.

Elemental defense buffs, however, do tend to be useful on defense. For example, Kasshrek’s fire resistance, Guinevere’s dark resistance, and Kunchen’s holy resistance help them survive much longer in the tank position.

[Papca]

It is clear now. Thank you!

[jinbatsu]

@lexinen

So if a defender fielded Jackal + Joon and they fired their specials in the right order at the same target, Joon’s attack would indeed deal extra damage due to Jackal’s holy defense debuff.

I don’t think so, because Joon skill attack is not elemental damage.
Ursena is Elemental damage, Gramemake is Elemental Damage.

[lexinen]

Here’s a video example:

- YouTube

Alasie’s special is non-elemental but does extra damage when Frida’s ice defense debuff is active (566 without, 855 with).

[jinbatsu]

@lexinen

Alasie’s special is non-elemental but does extra damage when Frida’s ice defense debuff is active (566 without, 855 with).

Well, thats about offense.
We are talking about the case as defender.
Just like you write:

@lexinen

Some attacks are considered non-elemental and do the same amount of damage to all elements. The following attacks are considered non-elemental:

• Special attacks by the player’s heroes.
• Both normal and special attacks by enemies (including enemy heroes and titans).
• Damage Over Time (DOT) effects like burn and poison.

Jackal+Joon will not has advantage.
Frida+Alasie also has not anvantage.

But then, I’m not sure Jackal+Ursena (because Ursena is written in skill damage more to yellow). And Jackal debuff elemental yellow which is applied to damage yellow more, or must be from hero Yellow, if must be from hero Yellow, then Ursena has no advantage. Otherwise if damage yellow like Ursena applied, thats has advantage for Jackal+Ursena.

[Kerridoc]

Jackal+Joon specials works on either side of the board, though the odds that the AI will choose the same target are too low.

What we think is true is that the slash attack of a defender is colorless. Example: defending Frida casts, then the next turn gets her slash attack. The slash attack hits for normal damage.

There is no synergy between Jackal and Ursena. Jackal’s special makes its target more susceptible to holy damage. Ursena’s attack does more damage against holy foes.

[jinbatsu]

@Kerridoc

Jackal+Joon specials works on either side of the board

OK, if the fact has advantage, thats means the theory is wrong.

It says: Non-elemental = Both normal and special attacks by enemies (including enemy heroes and titans).

@Kerridoc

There is no synergy between Jackal and Ursena. Jackal’s special makes its target more susceptible to holy damage. Ursena’s attack does more damage against holy foes.

Well, oke make sense, thank you for the explanation, it only effect holy foes not damage more to holy, sorry I have wrong assmumption.

[lexinen]

Right, but the elemental defense buffs/debuffs don’t require the attack itself to be elemental damage; it just has to come from a hero/enemy of that color.

@lexinen

Elemental defense buffs and debuffs affect all attacks originating from a character of that element even if it isn’t considered an elemental attack. For example, Kashhrek’s fire shield reduces Fire damage, meaning that any attacks originating from a Fire character (like red tiles, Kelile’s Dance of Fire special attack, or normal attacks from red titans) will be reduced by this shield.

[Papca]

@lexinen

Alasie’s special is non-elemental but does extra damage when Frida’s ice defense debuff is active (566 without, 855 with).

Very interesting.

But shouldn’t be the second Alasie’s special much more? I believe the second special should do 1 614 damage.

Let me show my computation:
Frida debuf is -54% against ice.
Alasie’s special is 462%

Computation of damage: (attack/defence)^1.35*462

First damage of Alasie:
(attack/defence)^1.35*462 = 566
(attack/defence)^1.35 = 1.225
(attack/defence) = 1.1622

So we can compute from the first special that attack / defence is 1.1622 and use it for the second special.

Second special of Alasie:
(attack/defence/Frida debuf)^1.35462 = ?
(1.1622/Frida debuf)^1.35462 = ?
(1.1622/0.46)^1.35462 = ?
2.526^1.35462 = ?
3.49*462 = 1 612

So second Alasie special with Frida debuf should be 1 614 instead 855. This is quite a difference.

Or there is an easier conmputation: First special damage * (1/0.46)^1.35 = First special damage * 2.85. It gives same result.

[jinbatsu]

@lexinen

Right, but the elemental defense buffs/debuffs don’t require the attack itself to be elemental damage; it just has to come from a hero/enemy of that color.

Yes that works for offense, that how it works we know it and we can test it by farming.
But the question @Papca is

@Papca

Does it also mean that Evelyns or Jackals colour debuf does not work in defence?

Thats what I want more clear explanation. Not as offense, but as defense / defender.

[lexinen]

My Frida and Alasie are unleveled, which will skew the damage numbers downward. In fact, that’s why I used them instead of Jackal+Joon for the example; my 4^70+11 Jackal might come close to one-shotting a yeti.

[lexinen]

Fair enough. I will see if I can get a recording of a raid with an elemental debuffer on defense. Based on my experience with raiding, I’m pretty sure that the defending heroes’ slashes and specials are higher if they hit an attacking hero with an elemental defense debuff.

Alternatively, bringing an elemental defense buffer to a raid should work similarly to reduce defender slashes/specials, but I don’t have any leveled up to be able to do that right now.

[jinbatsu]

@lexinen

I’m pretty sure that the defending heroes’ slashes and specials are higher if they hit an attacking hero with an elemental defense debuff.

OK, if you think so, then you should edit your theory:

@lexinen

Some attacks are considered non-elemental and do the same amount of damage to all elements. The following attacks are considered non-elemental:

• Special attacks by the player’s heroes.
• Both normal and special attacks by enemies (including enemy heroes and titans).
• Damage Over Time (DOT) effects like burn and poison.

Non-elemental = Both normal and special attacks by enemies ( including enemy heroes and titans).

[Papca]

Ok. But the difference between first and second Alasie special still should be x 1.993.

In the reality it is only x 1.551.

Was there any update changing how debufs work?

[lexinen]

The theory looks correct as written to me. Assuming the defense stats of the targets are similar, the theory should produce these results:

• If a blue hero on defense slashes at an attacking hero, it will deal the same amount of damage to a red hero as to a green hero. This makes it non-elemental.
• If a blue hero on defense uses a special on an attacking hero, it will deal the same amount of damage to a red hero as to a green hero. This makes it non-elemental. (Athena is an exception as her special gets the +40% boost against fire.)
• If the red/green attacking heroes have an ice defense debuff applied to them, the defending blue hero will deal more damage to both of them with slashes and specials, but it will still be the same increased amount of damage to the red hero as to the green hero.

[jinbatsu]

@lexinen

If a blue hero on defense slashes at an attacking hero, it will deal the same amount of damage to a red hero as to a green hero. This makes it non-elemental.

@lexinen

If a blue hero on defense uses a special on an attacking hero, it will deal the same amount of damage to a red hero as to a green hero. This makes it non-elemental. (Athena is an exception as her special gets the +40% boost against fire.)

Yes, thats also applied on ofense case. Special Attack is not depend on strong/weak color, except it is written on skill, like example damage more to holly or Athena as written in card Deals extra damage against Fire. (this is correct on both side offense and defense).
I Agree here.

@lexinen

If the red/green attacking heroes have an ice defense debuff applied to them, the defending blue hero will deal more damage to both of them with slashes and specials, but it will still be the same increased amount of damage to the red hero as to the green hero.

Now this is what I want more clear explanation…here is the conflict, offense has ice debuff, the defending blue hero attack the offense and deal more damage because the hero is blue.

But your theory say: non-elemental including enemy hero.