šŸ¦… Ilmarinen ā€“ 5* Fire / Red from Legends of Kalevala

At minimum I feel like Ilmarinen needs a speed boost to Average. It wouldnā€™t make him great, but it would make him significantly more generally useful.

If his DD were flat-out uncleansable (or even ā€œuncleansable if any blue targetā€) instead of only uncleansable on blue, that could make him more remarkable and potentially useful.

4 Likes

Got him from Epic completion EHT :grinning:


5 Likes

I just got him.

  • Mana reduction
  • enemies shared damage
  • -56% DD

Only shared damage + DD = fine with average speed.
But
Big deal is, Mana reduction ā€¦. where his slow speed becomes valid.

What does that make Wilbur then, given that he does shared damage + DD plus allied shared damage + DU, at Average?

The problem I have with mana reduction at Slow is thatā€¦

ā€¦youā€™d like to do mana reduction like, before, opponents fire.

Iā€™m still (at glacial pace) training up mine butā€¦ being able to cut opponentsā€™ mana after theyā€™ve all fired at least once, knowing that all of them will refill far faster than Ilmarinen will be able to fire again, doesnā€™t seem all that exciting.

It feels like giving up half of Wilburā€™s special to get something thatā€™s worse at Slow.

4 Likes

While itā€™s not a stated rule or a hard guideline, it would be nice if they at least followed precedent in designing 5 star hero specials to be better than 4 star hero specials when they are similar. I also agree and I think the reason (however illogical) ilmarinen is slow is because of the mana cut he does. However it is disappointing when a season 1 four star (li xiu) hero does the mana cut to all at average speed, and a 3 star bauchan does it at average speed.

You might be able to argue the rest of ilmarinenā€™s special is way better than the rest of the 4 star or 3 star heroesā€™ specials, and argue that warrants making ilmarinen slower than them. But then weā€™d disagree.

Yeah what Iā€™m seeing is something like Ilmarinen gets a slightly-better-than-half-Wilburā€™s-ability, a slightly-better-than-half-Li-Xiuā€™s-ability, theyā€™re both Average, Ilmarinen isā€¦ Slow.

I donā€™t think Ilmarinen would be a problem at Average. Iā€™m not even sure heā€™d be great at Average, but heā€™d be better, at least.

We live in world in which Diaochan gets a buff, I think Ilmarinen going one speed category better is just going to make himā€¦ somewhat more usable.

5 Likes

I also like and wish many thingsā€¦. But the hero design will be made as per some rationale.

Thatā€™s what I wrote above.

At average speed he becomes OPā€¦.

  • Rest is an easy guess.

Iā€™m not understanding the hate this guy is getting.

Are people only looking at him for raiding?

This is a good solid hero. Will be great for events. Great for titans (bigger DD than Wilbur) Great for maps and towers.

Yes he is slow. At average speed for raids he would be easy to make functionally fast. Is the point of a hero being useable or not that he can give 56% DD to all in 9 tiles, plus cut mana, plus make everyone share damage?

This is without even going into his passives which are solid. One of the best classes or that his effects last longer/ impact more/ become uncleansable against ice.

6 Likes

Imarinen, in my opinion, should remove the fact that he puts the enemies to share since that ability subtracts instead of adding. It would be better if the damage sharers are his allies and not his enemies and lower it to medium mana speed.

1 Like

I put him on tank in this Rush war and so far heā€™s holdinā€™ the team nicely with 3 attacks for 2-3 points. Especially, that this is the only red tank on the field (we have a policy to put the ā€˜bestā€™ one, so the rest are Alfrikes and similar likes).

So I guess that majority of attacks are with blue heroes, and he punishes them greatly - with huge mana cut and undispellable - 56% def and shared damage. With slow AoE around, if he fires the blues are quickly dead.

2 Likes

I dont have enough mats to use them on slow heroes that Iā€™d only use for rush wars and titans. Iā€™m sure others do have enough mats and Iā€™m sure these slow heroes do great when they use them

I guess I am not seeing how Average speed Ilmarinen is OP. How does having ā€œWilburā€™s big brotherā€ at Wilburā€™s speed pose a problem?

(Compare also to, say, Diaochan substantially healing and summoning kleptomaniac minions at Fast, and still she gets buffedā€¦forā€¦rea$on$.)

4 Likes

Trueā€¦ Average speed mana cutters were never really OP, but they have a place.

He should be as well, since doesnt do much otherā€¦

New Version of costume Leonidas has same feature of mana cut and undispellable defense down (albeit lower) but he also deals significant dmg to all, where Ilmarinen after casting, goes back to smiling for pictures :slight_smile:

2 Likes

In fact, Iā€™ve heard of this season 1 four star hero possess this skill at average speed - and on top of this I heard this OP season 1 hero also did direct damage to all!! Even without a costume!!

2 Likes

You mean the 4star with the powderpuff hit that is often in the top tanks & defence teams of 4star tournaments, but this guy along with the mana cut gives a massive defence down and forces shared damage?

How about the slow 3 star who only does some of what Ilmarinen does, but is considered an absolute requirement in events at his level?

Again, Raids are not the only thing in this game. This is a good hero. Keep an eye out for him in the next challenge event top scorers and Vs next green mythic titan.

3 Likes

For those interested in mythic titans and challenging for top 1000 event scores. Congratulations, hereā€™s a marginally better hero than the ones Iā€™m sure top event scorers were already using.

Unfortunately, I donā€™t have the ascension mats to ascend a slow hero that sucks in 90% of the game.

Happy you like him though. Doesnā€™t mean players that donā€™t think heā€™s good are too stupid to realize raiding isnā€™t the only part of the game.

3 Likes

Firstly, I pulled Ilmarinen and will be most happy to have him at average speed.
But, I have no interest in convincing you or anyone & hence will leave it to your thoughts & imagination & a question !

  • SG gave him slow speed for a reason & that reason is not the similar to the Wilbur specialā€¦ :wink:

Maybe itā€™s the same reason they first released atomos as slow, or the same reason they made guardian owl very slow? - they canā€™t/wonā€™t make every hero as good as the next so inevitably some are weaker. Not every hero can be as good as costume guardian panther. (Well actually they could but then they might make less money)

See, this is the thing:

I am never, ever, ever, ever going to have any reasonable chance to place in a top 1000 pretty much anything, with or without Ilmarinen.

And I care about raids exactly enough to have a small mountain of raid flasks gathering dust forever.

Iā€™d like a good all-around hero I can usefully turn to in many situations as my 5* red roster is thin, andā€¦ Iā€™m leveling him right now because my alternatives are pretty much S1 duplicates.

And Iā€™m not saying Iā€™ll never use him, just he seems disappointing when actually OP heroes are raining from the sky and Ilmarinen seemsā€¦ niche or ā€œin the right combo,ā€ but I donā€™t have, e.g., a Xnolphod and Ludwig to sandwich him between.

So hereā€™s the thing for me he is a good all around hero and heā€™s not a niche hero either.

Good for maps & PVE
Fantastic for events.
Great for Titans.
Fine for raid attack.
Decent for raid defence as he punishes the colour people want to take against him more.

He doesnā€™t need a Xnol or Ludwig to make him great.

Being slow is not a huge detriment. I use slow heroes in raids in diamond all the time. I have a slow hero in my defence and I stay in Diamond.

Too much is being made of just use Wilbur instead like these are exactly the same. Wilburā€™s Def down is less, doesnā€™t have the potential to become Uncleanseable, doesnā€™t have the mana cut and doesnā€™t have the passives. Also this guy has 5 star stats so doesnā€™t suffer from needing the emblems and LB for sustainability in the same way.

My main point in here has been my annoyance with people making out that he is useless. He isnā€™t. We need to be careful about calling heroes useless, new players come and read this forum all the time. We may not have use for certain heroes, but someone skimming through may see a hero called useless that would be really good for their situation and then not level.

9 Likes