Damage Calculation

[yelnats_24]

I’m a little bit confused regarding the effect of ramming pulverizer -34% defense, shouldn’t it result in:
(1/(1-0.34)^1.35 = 1.752x damage or 75% increase?

After some discussion in Anzgogh thread, I collect small data while farming. I compare Scarlett 4/50 skill damage against boss of S1:5-4 (the left one) with or without -34 def down:

#	Normal	34% def debuff
Average	748	1085
1	742	1115
2	754	1054
3		1086

Actual increase = 45%
It’s closer to calculation without exponents which have 52% increase

I know that the sample size is too small, but it seems some other have also experienced that:

@Dandaniel1234

Unfortunately in reality Wilbur and Falcon won’t increase the damage Anzogh does by 6 times.
Nothing wrong with your math, but when I use them all three, the damage is only
doubled. Wilbur, Falcon and Anzogh (other fire heroes give same results, e.g. Scarlett) are 8/8 special. With Wilbur, Falcon and Wu it gets to 4 times, but only when it hits

@yelnats_24

I do find it a bit off when I experimented with level 1 Frida and Valen in my alt account.

I was using this formula:

@SolemnWolf

Damage ≈ 100 x ( θ x Att / Def ) ^ 1.35

In that formula, -40% in defense from Frida will result in:
100 x ( θ x Att / (1-40%) Def ) ^ 1.35
= ((1 / 0.6) ^ 1.35) x 100 x ( θ x Att / Def ) ^ 1.35
= 1.993 x (100 x ( θ x Att / Def ) ^ 1.35)
= 1.993 Damage

However when I try it with Ragnhild, it only increase it from 39 to 65 (1.667 times damage)

It is as if there is no ^1.35
1/(1-40%) = 1/0.6 = 1.667

This is also the case when I combined Frida, Valen, and Ragnhild.

If there is ^1.35
The result should have been:
1/(1-0.4)^1.35 = 1.993x damage (from Frida -40% ice defense)
1/(1-0.2)^1.35 = 1.352 damage (from Valen -20% defense)
1.993 x 1.352 = 2.694x damage

However my Ragnhild damage was only increased from 39 to 78 (2x) as if there is no ^1.35:
1/(1-40%) = 1/0.6 = 1.667
1/(1-20%) = 1/0.8 = 1.25
1.667 x 1.25 = 2

@Dandaniel1234

Nothing wrong with your math, but when I use them all three, the damage is only
doubled.

As I have mentioned above, my Ragnhild damage was doubled with -40% elemental defense debuff and -20 defense debuff. Therefore, I believe that with Falcon -54% elemental defense debuff and Wilbur -44% debuff, the result should have been more than doubled.

Suppose we ignore the ^1.35, it will be:
1/(1-54%) = 1/0.46 = 2.174
1/(1-44%) = 1/0.56 = 1.786
2.174 x 1.786 = 3.882x damage

If there is indeed ^1.35, it should be:
1/(1-54%)^1.35 = 1/0.46^1.35 = 2.853
1/(1-44%)^1.3/= 1/0.56^1.35 = 2.187
2.853 x 2.187 = 6.241x damage

Can you post a comparative screenshoot?

@Kerridoc is more familiar with damage formula, I hope he can point out why Wilbur + Falcon only result in doubling the damage from Anzogh. Maybe he can also check my math whether it’s correct or not.

N.B.: I only did it one time so it doesnt’ take into account random parameter.

@Dandaniel1234

@yelnats_24

As I have mentioned above, my Ragnhild damage was doubled with -40% elemental defense debuff and -20 defense debuff. Therefore, I believe that with Falcon -54% elemental defense debuff and Wilbur -44% debuff, the result should have been more than doubled.

My results are more consistent with this math:
when it states the defense is reduced by x% the damage is increased by
(1+(x/100))^1.35 so for example for:

-Falcon the damage is increased 1.54^1.35=1.791 (79% increase)
-Wilbur the damage is increased 1.44^1.35=1.636 (64% increase)
-Gormek (or Valen or many others) 1.34^1.35=1.484

The relationship between debuffs seems additive rather than multiplicative and
for targets debuffed by both Wilbur and Falcon the damage Anzogh (or other reds)
would do is 1+0.791+0.636=2.427
I know it’s more than doubled, but it’s not even close to 6 times or even triple

@Argon

Nicely caught. It seems there indeed isn’t ^1.35 in damage formula for elementally debuffed enemies. I’m happy I managed this little test on my first try

Attacking hero:

First case:

Without exponent: 100×(4,62×938÷(1,2x811×0,46)) = 968 ([587…1595] with random parameter), damage done: 1142, with exponent: 2142.

Second case:

Without exponent: 100×(4,62×938÷(1,2×(962−328)×0,46)) = 1238 ([751…2041] with random parameter), damage done: 1182, with exponent: 2987

Edit: Added 1.2 multiplier for 20% defense bonus for defense team.

@Garanwyn

@Kerridoc may well have better information on some of this than I. But here’s my understanding:

@Solemnwolf didn’t talk about elemental debuffs because they didn’t exist yet when he made the damage equation.

But it appears that all elemental effects, such as buffs and debuffs, happen outside the exponential. Strong and weak tiles, which have a factor of 2x and 0.5x respectively, are known to apply outside the exponential. And I believe that this is how elemental buffs and debuffs work.