đŸ§Ș Early Information on Season 3 Valhalla Summon Portal [Part of The Beta Beat V27]

The Summon costs seen in Beta are in the top post of this thread.

1 Like

Thank you very much
20 Valhalla coins

1 Like

No it isn’t. Just look at how many people are saying they’re not drawing because of JF nerf, and waiting til telluria instead. If every new HoTM is like Margaret, you can bet there will be a lot less f2p/c2p players venturing into higher spending territory.

Assertion without proof or even evidence.

These two statements don’t make logical sense at all.

What does create a barrier to entry is “retiring” old content that is better than new content; i.e new players can never get the same level of heroes older players can.

Power Creep does not create a barrier to entry at all. Let’s take a look at an extreme case.

Let’s pretend for a second, that next month, new 7 star heroes are released with 3000+ atk, 3000+ def and 6000+ hp and overpowered specials.

How does that create a barrier of entry to new players? On the contrary, it completely evens the playing field between old and new players, because all of the heroes older players have are effectively made obsolete.

So as it has been proven, power creep lowers the barrier to entry for newer players. Gatekeeping older, stronger heroes is the way that creates a barrier between newer and older players.

This is a red herring. No one is saying he is absolutely unbeatable. The point is, there is no valid reason that GM or Ursena or Insert_hero_here should remain the most desirable hero in the game til the end of time.

Your point about counters is also a logical fallacy that tricks people into thinking it’s a relevant argument when it absolutely isn’t.

Ultimately, no matter what meta shift, no matter what “counters” exists, there’s one hard statistic: Percentage use of a hero.

For example, right now, Ursena has something like 26% use as tank. Kunchen and Guin are at something like 20%. This means for all intents and purposes, Ursena is the best tank.

No matter what happens, there will always be a best tank, a best flank, a best wing, a best titan hitter and so on. And there is absolutely no reason that this best hero has to be a hero that is already released, and newer heroes can only have niche usage to “counter” specific heroes. THAT is creating a huge barrier for newer players; they can only ever hope to get niche heroes that can only be used occasionally to counter those much stronger heroes that they can’t obtain.

2 Likes

[quote=“Zathrus, post:66, topic:156755”]
No, what you want is something for you to pull for, which means perpetual power creep. Which is what does shut out new players and ruin games.
Zathras, I started this game roughly the beginning of S2. (I think everyone agrees S2 heroes are better then S1 now and then). Being competitive by nature I quickly decided S1 heroes were not worth the mats. If I wanted to play at the top level it would be spending a bit of money and getting HOTM , event and S2 heroes and using the mats wisely ( I’m thinking most people of that nature visited the forumns/line groups where a lot of info is out there). It was obvious that there was 1000’s of players that had a year or more head start and it would be the only way to catch them. So, after maxing 5 of each element you can pretty much be competitive ( top 100 alliance) for wars and titans. Did the game break because I said screw S1 heroes and screw tc20? No-it didn’t. Do players still compete at the top with S1 heroes- of course they do. Those players who have been playing longer using S1 have higher troop levels and more hero selection and that bridges the gap and actually surpasses “the power creep” between seasons 1-2.But, it has allowed me to compete in top 100. If they keep S3 heroes the same power level as S2
 how does a player that starts the game today ever have a chance to catch up and play at the top?He has no chance- he will always be behind. Even if he spends a boat load of money to get 25-30 heroes maxed in a short time everyone else will stay ahead of him forever. Your quote I’ve highlighted above accusing me “of just wanting something to pull for” is completely wrong. No, I don’t want to chase heroes but yes I’m not afraid of having too compete against stronger heroes. I look at reply’s like yours or “nerf” the new guy who came out in beta as long term players not wanting to do “anymore pulls” and getting to hold on to their positions at the top with less effort.

@zephyr1

In the season 3 event notes they mentioned that folks completed S2 province 15 can access the s3 maps. What about the Valhalla portal ? Is it also restricted ?

This must be a typo?

It’s been corrected in the official post

2 Likes

have the final stats and skills of the heroes that are going to be available listed?

Moderator’s Note

A reminder that Forum Rules prohibit personal attacks and insults.

4 Likes

If it’s this heated before the release, I got my popcorn ready for the aftermath. Anyone got the over/under on s1 dupe pull rage quits?

2 Likes

game design power creep - Google Search

Or go read some of the published papers on it. Or look at other collectible games that fell over under it and had to completely restart (Star Wars Armada being one of the more recent).

And, yes, it does create a barrier to entry, because new content has to be created to challenge people with the power creep. Don’t have that new group of heroes? Then you effectively cannot even keep pace.

Sure, except I didn’t say anything about gatekeeping. That’s starting to become an issue in this game (cf — “Can I still get Hel?” Thread), and if we’re lucky HA will address that.

And you’re making a logical fallacy here, because you presume they will be AND that I made that argument. Neither is true.

Ursena being desirable is fine as long as it’s not the one and only desirable hero for that spot. Which currently isn’t true, but nothing I’ve said prevents that from changing.

But this is all increasingly off topic. And now that we know S3 heroes will be batched, not much point in debating it until we see them (and future HotMs) and how they compare to current A and A+ heroes.

Yes, you absolutely did.

Right there.

No, that is exactly what’s implicit in your argument. You are arguing for ZERO power creep. The defining characteristic of that is that there is no hero in the future who is more desirable than current heroes. That is the definition of no power creep.

If a future hero is more desirable, then it is definitionally a power creep. So, I don’t think you understand the implications of the statements you’re making.

To show that something is inevitable, you can’t just use a single example. For example, I could say “uncle bob created a business and failed, therefore you can never succeed in making businesses”. You can see how ridiculous that statement is.

Power creep CAN kill a game, but I can show you any number of examples of games that went stale and died because it stalled and did not have power creep. But that doesn’t prove anything.

You can have well managed power creep, and out of control power creep.

The one statement I agree with you on, is that we are way off topic; by the way, I think many of us are still curious whether this month’s S3 portal will last into march.

Ah. Terminology difference. By retirement I meant “removal from play”. So if they decided to retire hero X, you would no longer be able to use them (or, as in many systems, not in the most rewarding game types).

And hopefully it will go to March. They’ve at least set the expectation of more than two days for a season portal.

From the release notes:

  • The available Season III Legendary Heroes, as well as the available Heroes of The Month, change each month.

This implies that the pool isn’t going to be filled at a drip feed but changed each month.

Not sure if that is better or worse.

2 Likes

I believe that is just referring to the “featured” hero

Petri confirmed that the HotM compontn was just referring to the months HotM being different each portal.

@Petri can we confirm if the “season 3 legendary hero” part is just referring to the featured hero being different each month?

1 Like

Does anyone know if Valhalla coins will become loot in chests, mystic vision, etc? The release notes don’t say anything about it, but maybe beta testers read something about it on the coin description.

1 Like

I actually asked the Small Giant Staff that along with some other questions, but haven’t gotten answers yet.

I’ll definitely post an update if I can get clarification on that.

11 Likes

@1Peterboy
@CMR
@Waffleelder
@Handyman1022

Well all very interesting but having conducted a straw pole of my alliance whats available in the portal is somewhat academic as no one has any mats to ascent 5* heros. Some new 4*'s would be more useful. A thought about power creep, new heros could have different skills or maybe an odd mix of stats without being more powerful. Perhaps ones that need other heros to work well, so team synergy becoming more important.

3 Likes

This has been discussed in our combined Line groups at length as well. Not one person is really excited about it as most of us are still waiting for mats to ascend premium S2, past & current HoTM’s. On the contrary, many say it will make their current rosters redundant and want to quit because of it (many have btw). We are mostly L60-80 players with 2+ years which means we are stuck with ascended S1 heores while those that started later have a better mix. Loot has been nerfed heavily, we track a few accounts (18 months) and saw a sharp decline twice. Since Mid November it dropped to 1 epic pm for most. People including myself are so dejected and without hope we basically log on just to maintain these extremely expensive investments. The fun and growth are gone.
P2P players get hit the hardest as they may afford to summon a little more than C2P but can’t afford to buy mats via portals & shop like whales. P2P will disappear imho

3 Likes