[Poll thread] in a 1 to 📈 4 scale, are S1 5* heroes and their costumes good enough?

[FraVit93]

So, this is the idea: let the players express their point of view about S1 5* heroes in anticipation of possible balance updates.

Everyone is invited to speak their mind and make suggestions about possible hero improvements.

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The grade values are as follows:

1: the hero is weak and easily replaceable

2: the hero is weak but hardly replaceable

3: the hero is good but easily replaceable

4: the hero is good and hardly replaceable

costume variant

Do you ever buff old Heroes?

From time to time, we do buff older Heroes to keep them viable and fun to play with. We review player feedback on existing Heroes routinely, so the best way to get your opinion heard is to share your ideas on our Community Forum, under the Ideas & Feature Requests category.

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S1 Domitia

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Domitia

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Obakan

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Obakan

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Quintus

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Quintus

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Sartana

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Sartana

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Joon

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Joon

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Justice

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Justice

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Leonidas

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Leonidas

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Vivica

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Vivica

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Isarnia

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Isarnia

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Magni

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Magni

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Richard

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Richard

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Thorne

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Thorne

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Elkanen

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Elkanen

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Horghall

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Horghall

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Kadilen

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Kadilen

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Lianna

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Lianna

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Azlar

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Azlar

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Elena

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Elena

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Khagan

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Khagan

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Marjana

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

S1 Marjana

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4

[nevarmaor]

I am presuming the costume includes both costumed and costume-bonus versions. For some, IMHO, the costume itself is not as great an improvement as the bonus is to the uncostumed version. I am thinking of Lianna here for example.

[Cheds]

I think it was more just Original vs Costume. How I voted anyways.

I must have brought Khagan up all by myself with my vote of 4. I’m not sure people realise how awesome he is after his double buff last year

[nevarmaor]

I voted on how they compared to other heroes, as the focus seems to be on who needs balancing.

I did give C.Khagan a 3. He is really good now but not unreplaceable. OTOH Horghall got 1 and 1.

I don’t quite get the “weak but hardly replaceable” for 2 though. If a hero is weak it is replaceable, even with a unique special.

[sleepyhead]

thanks for doing this @FraVit93 . Appreciate it took a lot of work.

@nevarmaor , personally I considered base version as including costume bonus (i.e., factoring in boosted stats and faster mana speed…) so my point of differentiations were the specials and classes

I needed to think about this a bit…

replaceable is an interesting word. if I compare some of these heroes to other vanillas, that’s one thing. but it’s difficult to compare the more easily-obtained vanillas to, say, Underwild or Valhalla or Event heroes… I had to think quite a bit!

[nevarmaor]

Interesting.

Considering this from a balancing perspective, my approach was which S1 are decent enough still without costume (Lianna, Joon) and which are improved enough to become decent with costume/costume bonus (Leonidas, Kadilen). And of course which are still not very good either way (Horghall).

Maybe it’s my f2p bias showing

[RebelForces]

Costume bonus, today, gives a good improvement to them. Problem is, without that, imo, they’re all mediocre at this point. Newer Epics have almost the same stats as S1 legendaries and that’s something I just can’t understand.

At the middle of this year, even costume versions will have mediocre stats. The % of damage they deal is not relevant. Look at Quintus, 270% damage to all for slow speed with ridiculous ATK points. Newer heroes at average speed dealing 200% (some even more!!!) to all with almost 100 extra ATK points will deal even more damage and PLUS they always have incredible side effects.

We had a major balance update in the past that buffed most of S1, guardian Kong, MokArr and many others with reworking their special skills. The costumes did the same.

The question is today sartana with costume bonus and +20 emblems have the same stats as 0 emblem Dark Lord. So??? Well.

For me it’s kinda simple. They are all super outdated, ridiculous slow and weak. Costumes will help, more for some (azlar, Leo, marjana) not that much for others (Isarnia, Horhgall, elkanen).

Yet it doesn’t matter because of the power creep. The costumes that were an excuse as for “buffing” them even being paid, are now getting far behind again. Look at Quenell lmao she will snipe like Lianna on 3 heroes. Wolfgang deals Quintus damage + 2 cool effects for average mana.

It’s not like S1 should be on pair with newer heroes but they’re just mediocre and someone must say it

[Chadmo]

Excellent post and poll. It’s clear that EDD increases the value immensely. Most of the votes fell in line with my opinions as well. The costume chamber was a great addiditon IMO.

[Jack.O.Kent]

I can only talk for cmagni, cjoon and cviv.

Two of which are beasts - mag and viv.

I play solo so I can choose my tank - I use cviv as a war tank and she’s leg-endary, I’ve had great feedback from war opponents.

I’ve also got cjus but not max’d yet so can’t comment.

[Chadmo]

C Justice is a bummer. I was so excited but I use her in my later teams in rush war only. Sometimes in rush tournaments but even then sparingly.

[Jack.O.Kent]

That’s a shame, thanks for the reply.

[FraVit93]

So far the early votes are separating the grain from the chaff.
At the moment most of the costumes are proving themselves as good heroes.

The prime candidates for buffs would unsurprisingly be Horghall, Quintus, Obakan, Justice and Horghall (equal merit with Thorne).

To notice that 4 out of the 5 “worst” scoring heroes were recently buffed in the Version 37 Release Notes & Status but for the moment the votes shows that the improvements weren’t enough.

While speed up buffs has already been done in the past it the buff policy aims to still keep speed diversity. Whereas these special (damage+targeting+effect)/speed would be enough or not is up to debate.

• TIM: High level - always aim for variety instead of pure ‘race for ultimate power’ . So slower heroes must also be in the game, though not everyone will be ‘optimal ’. Of course, we try to buff these heroes later - but very important to not do the buff via speed up, even if players see it as the only option > this way we’d end up with only fast heroes in the game, which is boring!

Poll order	Hero name	avg. Score	Votes
40	Marjana	3.89	63
30	Kadilen	3.85	61
14	Leonidas	3.63	63
16	Vivica	3.47	62
20	Magni	3.43	61
10	Joon	3.2	65
8	Sartana	3.08	61
32	Lianna	3.05	59
34	Azlar	2.95	61
31	Lianna	2.66	64
9	Joon	2.63	65
18	Isarnia	2.57	63
38	Khagan	2.52	60
2	Domitia	2.39	57
36	Elena	2.33	61
19	Magni	2.3	64
7	Sartana	2.28	65
15	Vivica	2.27	64
26	Elkanen	2.2	61
24	Thorne	2.14	58
22	Richard	2.12	59
4	Obakan	2.1	61
39	Marjana	2.09	64
12	Justice	1.95	61
17	Isarnia	1.95	65
1	Domitia	1.88	64
29	Kadilen	1.79	61
37	Khagan	1.73	62
6	Quintus	1.68	62
21	Richard	1.65	63
33	Azlar	1.62	63
13	Leonidas	1.61	63
25	Elkanen	1.52	63
35	Elena	1.51	61
23	Thorne	1.48	62
28	Horghall	1.48	61
11	Justice	1.32	63
3	Obakan	1.23	65
5	Quintus	1.17	65
27	Horghall	1.1	63

[Cheds]

Still can’t believe Khagan is sat at 1.7

Either people never ascended him or they haven’t tried him since the double buff. Either way he is an awful lot better than that score.

But if enough people don’t like him maybe my favourite buddy gets another buff. I’d not be saying no.

[FraVit93]

Khagan’s isn’t that bad, at the moment he is “weak but hardly replaceable”.
Maybe there would have been better ways of grading.

Hardly replaceable as he is a Tower & Events powerhouse but weak as it isn’t as good as similar heroes like Saoirse for Tower & Events or Faline/Quenell for the other aspects of the game.