I tested it with Gato (same buff as Grazul) and Jeanâs buff always takes priority against defense ailments, regardless of the order they were casted in.
2 Likes
The correct is that dispelers are not rare, as you said. Rigard would not dispel the initial turn, which would make little difference to a hero without immediate damage. Zinkhita has speed to dissipate on an equal footing and Grazul is even faster to avoid his action. The game is interesting because it is diverse and often unpredictable.
If cases like Neith and Anzogh can be avoided, so be it. Or can you say that Neith is a strong / good heroine the way she is? How many people argued that she would be before her release.
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There is zero chance this guy isnât nerfed before release. Starting to think SG just displays OP heroes to start a â buzzâ full well knowing it isnât happening.
8 Likes
Well, a few pointsâŠ
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Youâve cited exactly two examples of common defensive dispels, one of whom is decent but far from a major threat, and the other of whom is an average speed 4* that would be very likely to be charged too late to be relevant to the discussion were they placed at wing and are too much of a liability to be run at tank or flank as a âcounterâ to Jean.
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Even assuming that either of those were on the defense and were ready to fire right after Jean, the attackers are under no obligation to fire Jean before Zim or Rigard go off, and can simply wait a turn then apply the status effect.
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While it is true that Grazul would block Jean if he were fired immediately after her there is, yet again, nothing necessitating you firing Jean while her block is up. Also, if Jean fires first Grazul does not clear the DoT. Whatâs more, Grazul is an awful defender and if Jean is strong enough that people start running her on defense in a desperate attempt to counter him thatâs going to be even more to your benefit.
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Not sure why Neith is coming up, but I never said that her nerfed version was going to be a strong hero. Sheâs not awful, but nothing to write home about. As far as yellows go sheâs about the 3rd or 4th best tank, 2nd or 3rd best flank, and completely mediocre attacker. She wonât alter the meta, but as I stated in her discussion that is totally okay. We SHOULD NOT be rooting for every new hero of the month to be the next Gravemaker that redefines the teams of all top alliances. It simply isnât healthy for the game in the long run.
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I agree with you that we donât need to have one GM per month, but we donât need a monthly Anzogh either. A medium or bad HOTM discourages players a lot.
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To be clear, this hero has roughly double the damage output of Gravemaker in exchange for V.Fast to Fast. As a comparator, Azlar deals nearly identical total damage at slow mana that Jean does at fast, Azlar does so over a longer period of time, and does not provide the strong secondary buffs that Jean does.
7 Likes
Kingston everywhere⊠Kingston everywhereâŠ
I see Kingston everywhere but not fricken my defense team.
Iâm pretty sure this will get minimum of two nerf bats, and not fast mana I dare you!
At this beta stage, bye bye to Azlar, Anzogh for the reason.
2 Likes
Itâs not double, the dot for gm is over 2 turns and Jean over 4. At 2 turns it is an improvement on gm ⊠however gm very fast mana plus does damage as well . Jean only does burn .
Plus gm is barbarian compared to jean who is wizard and has more competition for emblems .
Not saying this applies to you but I feel most people upset with Jean are those that are running double gm for so long
Is jean an improvement of course and more so due to other secondary effects , however with damage solely being from burn IMO balances a lot out
3 Likes
I just read his description again and I donât think heâs too OP because his effects are all dispellable and he does no actual damage. In order to keep his numbers the same, his duration should be increased to 5 turns and he should be made average mana. That is the best way, in my opinion, to keep him usable, but not terrible.
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Max mana is 26%
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Its not double because its even worse
Grave is 298 over 2 turns to 3 targets => 894 total damage
JF is 604 over 4 turns to 5 targets => 3020 total damage
Even if you were incredibly fortunate to find a triple nature def to hit with grave its a big step up
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Dispellable, ok, but:
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if heâs on defense, you need cleanser ready before he fires which is not an easy thing to manage. The only fast one is Zim. The only blue one is Ariel (and sheâs average). The hope is costumed Sonya will be a thing by Feb. None of these options is f2p friendly if anyone cares anymore.
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if he is on offense, it is super easy to play around the cleanser and just focus on staying alive. 150+ dmg per turn with a resistance+ to def aliments (bye bye Kunchen tanks)
Technically you can say GM is weak because he can be cleansed, while we know it is not true. Your team may be long dead before cleansing matters.
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If he is on attack: run an event 4* mana controller to shut down the cleanser, easy win.
If he is on defense: pray to not have his casts chained with AoE mana controllers such as Guinevere or Neith.
1 Like
The best situations when a very fast hero as Grazul will truly shine 
I already have a DoT-focused raid team, and I wouldnât mind having this guy too. With both him and GM on the team, along with Rana, the enemy team would basically be burning for big damage all the time and Rana would squelch heals. I have Sartana at 3-70, and the only reason why she isnât maxed is because I keep pulling better/more diverse dark heroes. Just before I took her to 4th ascension I pulled Seshat. Obvious choice there if you donât have the mats for both. Getting close to having 6 more tabards, and now Iâve pulled Ursena, and I need a good dark tank for wars. Sadly, Sartana goes to the back of the line again. Honestly, tho, even at 3-70, Sartana can be pretty good. I definitely want this guy tho.
The way I see it, and this applies to most OP HOTM:
If I pull 'em, keep em the same guys kthxbye
If I donât pull em: SG WHAT ARE YOU DOING, POWER CREEP etc etc
Hypocrisy is real, especially for me
But Iâll be in the second camp most of the time
6 Likes
Just how much initial damage do you think Gravemaker is doing that equals out the damage?
To make a few points clear, Jean is an improvement with or without the secondary effects.
Even if you do not agree with my assessment that the secondary effects arenât necessary for him to be OP, the fact that you can so readily admit that of course he is better than GM, the dominantly best hero currently in the game, should give everyone pause.
Maybe a strange opinion for most, but I think there are people on the same opinion. Believe Gravemaker is starting to lose his OP with emblems being widely spread now. Especially when he is on defense he is becoming less and less a problem ( at least for me) when attacking and talking about Grave + 10 and above. His DOT is being overcompensated more and more by embleming heroes with health nodes which gives more time for cleanse/ HOT/ pure heal. Havenât made a calcualtion ( which would be interesting to see ) for example Grave at +15 how much his DOT is increased in absolute terms vs non-emblemed Grave and how much more health average there is on +15 5* to compare apple to apple. So not surprised they are doing an upgrade of him, however with all the additional parts of his skill is becoming quite a OP hero - you need to bring dispeller and cleanser when attacking to remove his damage and defense buffs.
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Do you want GM to be the best hero of the game forever? Itâs natural they release an âupgrade versionâ of him, itâs part of the game. Every hero loses its crown sooner or later
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Iâm totally fine with you all making the argument that Jean is clearly better than the best hero currently in the game, and that it is a good and natural progression of the game⊠I disagree, but at least that is an honest argument. I just want the motivations to be clear to the other members on the forum who perhaps have not made up their minds about Jean, because others in your camp were arguing that Jean WAS NOT the new most overpowered hero in the game with purposely faulty logic, but the underlying motivations were pretty transparently the same.
1 Like