Not if you keep treating your players as cash cows you will do nothing until your cash income drops and it’s going to start dropping really quickly. People are starting to wise up to the fact that unless you are spending bid money on this game you or your alliance will not win anything if you go into war you will lose unless you have spent more money than your opponent we are pulling out of war as it’s just a sick joke we have 7 sub 2500 players we have been matched to a team that has 2 we have 4 players between 3000 3400 they have 7 3200 to 3770 and throw in field aid and bang you lose just stick 4 healers and 1 hitter win buy running out of time you have people putting out teams that are 400 points lower than there real teams this is happening to alliance and people big time and all of the time you go into war and have NO chance not even a slender luck maybe with me chance war has nothing to do with skill as field aid stamps on that .as for a fair match no chance you spend big you win and are guaranteed to win as your reward you spend small you lose as you will be matched to a team that out ranks and out guns you . As for this last Atlantis draw out of a 10 pull i got 4 of the same card then 3 of the same and 3 others all 3 stars tried again same 4 repeat followed by 3 repeat cards all 3 stars have not seen a 5 star or 4 star since xmas. it used to be that you spent £30 = 1 5 star now it’s working out at £75 = 1 5star . As for raids well thats a no joking matter the only people that can raid me are 3500 to 4000 plus player level can be up to 50 if I’m stupid enough to push the raid button I’ll not see one sub 3500 i used 200,000 hams and never once saw a sub 3500 i had only just touched the 3000 point just how many rolls have i got to do to find someone near my level to battle?
You really do have to make the game fair for ALL players NOT just the one’s with the endless credit card limit. Or better still refund the money you are well it’s not really stealing but i do stand a better chance of a return from a one armed bandit as they by law have to pay out a 70% return. Make it fair for everyone let skill have a say in wars not field aid let an alliance have a fair chance at war reward them for using all their flags why put a 2 week old alliance up against a 1yr old alliance that out ranks and out guns them by miles as nobody in their right mined would step in to the ring with 2 mike Tysons while they hand one hand tied to their leg and a patch on one eye but thats how your war matches are making people feel. If you would like to return half the money i have spent on this game and close my account I’d jump at the chance.
I tried to read that block of text several times, but my eyes blurred and I consistently gave up just a few lines into it. It’s partly my fault, I know - I come from a generation with the collective attention span of a goldfish and a general shortage of perseverance. I think it might also be partly your fault, though. It really helps to break up your text with paragraphing, at minimum, or headings, or numbering, or bullet points. It can also be good to include a TL/DR.
In keeping with my own advice, I’ll now include some bullet points:
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This thread seeks to identify how we can bring back some of the positivity the forum used to have - let’s say a year ago. OP (@Rigs) invites us to consider SG’s relationship with the player base and whether the company is effectively fostering open communication.
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@Rigs also invites us to consider what changes could be made to improve the game so that a fun, competitive, fair and balanced game can be profitably produced by the devs.
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I think this is a bit different from inviting players to identify all the things they don’t like about the game and how they would like them changed. There are already plenty of threads for that.
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In particular, if an aspect of the game has not changed over the last year then I think we can agree that that aspect is not a cause of a drop off in forum positivity, can’t we? Like, for example:
and
(The latter seems like an extremely questionable assertion, but even if it were true it certainly does not identify any game change that might have led to a fall in forum positivity.)
- Because, after all, this discussion is premised on identifying reasons that the forum is now less positive than it used to be, and ways to improve things. So if an issue is fundamental to the game, or even long-standing, then it’s probably not germane.
TL/DR: All opinions are always welcome, but this is not a thread for general complaints about the game. It aims to identify why forum positivity has dropped off and how that might be addressed.
I think some of the hostility comes from a lack of communication directly from SG. For instance, with new stuff coming out in the game it seems certain people are privy to info ie new characters, changes to gameplay etc. To me it would make sense for a SG rep to be on here and make the odd update. Like “hey we are introducing three new characters over next six months; red healer, blue cleric etc. Or were shooting for an “alchemy lab” in game that does xyz by this date” and we will be testing in beta next month. It would stop a lot of the hard feelings when the info is leaked from a player. Just my suggestion because I think whenever the “impression” is given that someone is privy beforehand people will have anamosity. The same people will be viewed as “favoured” and will conceivably be viewed as possibly being influential to SG. Monthly update direct from SG would help a lotI think. Could be just a five minute post really.
The problem is that this game demands more and more money. And few people actually feel that they receive something that is worth said money. The game gives more frustration than happiness. Between all the new heroes and the rumors that the new raid challenge will be pay 2 play one may think that SG forgot about the f2p players. And i think that a lot of negativity and frustration comes from here.
I have not found this to be the case. I have spent £5.98 in total, and have never found that the game has demanded more. But even if the game does demand “more and more money” the more you play it, hasn’t that always been the case? Nothing has changed in that respect, that might lead to a drop in forum positivity, has it?
Again though - has this changed in any way since a year ago? Based on the comments I read back then, I don’t think it has. So do you think this is responsible for a trend towards a lack of positivity in the forum, since then? How?
This is an oft repeated complaint. While it’s not true for me, it certainly seems to be true for a lot of people. However, this is nothing new - the forum was full of people saying this a year ago, so it can’t be responsible for a change in forum tone, can it?
There might be some truth here. I honestly can’t see how introducing new heroes could be seen as indicating that SG has “forgot[ten] about the f2p players”, but I do see that the possibility of raid challenges being pay 2 play might have that effect.
But the idea that raid challenges might be pay to play is just that - an idea. It just came to light a week or two ago and it’s not out of beta yet. So I don’t think that can be entirely responsible for a general trend towards more negativity in the forum - the issue is too new.
It might be one of many issues that are symptomatic of poor communication, however, which was part of @Rigs’ original thesis. Maybe it’s one of many issues that have piled up over time and have not been addressed by SG. Maybe several things like that have festered with forum participants leading to cynicism and suspicion and negativity.
Or maybe not. I don’t really know.
I think this thesis is important. Lack of communication between supplier and customer is never good. Communication takes work—on both sides—but the lead clearly has to be SGG’s.
Long ago I was a developer for a early online role-playing game. The paid staff was not very different in size from Small Giants staff, albeit many of us were part-time and there were fewer full-time employees. Nonetheless, we had a full website filled with information about how to play the game; we had an active news section. Developers and creative staff posted fairly frequently on the boards, outlining our future plans 9after those plans had been approved) and discussing the current releases. None of that is echoed by Small Giant’s communication approach.
This topic is on the top of my list for next week’s AMA.
The people leaking the info are beta testers and yes, they are influential to a degree, that’s the entire point of the testing program. They have no say in future ideas for features or heroes (or at least no more than anyone else who uses this forum and the ideas section) but they are there to provide feedback on features currently in production. However, they are just players, and the beta application is open to anyone so there shouldn’t be any feelings of favouritism, at least not resentful feelings from players who never applied for the program.
Also, as far as any of us know, everything that is in beta currently or expected to be soon, was given in advance by the creators in their end of year “sneak peak” thread months ago. Just more day-to-day communication would be nice, and if issues arise, whether real or not, more of a reply than the usual “no everything is fine” (the current mana generation discussion going on in another thread, for instance) would go a long way.
The problem with the new heroes is that they aren’t available in tc20. You can get them through sunmons. And yes you can add up some gems and atlantis coins, but at 3-4% chances to get a 5* i think you you need money for those new heroes. Don’t get me wrong. I am not criticizing SG. We are all here by choice. It was just a personal opinion about how i feel about the game at this point. I think people feel frustration because all the grind we put into developing our base isn’t quite worth It. It took me 6-7 months to reach tc 20. Now i have four and still i rely on summons for better heroes. As i said, this is just a personal opinion. I still enjoy the game and i will keep playing, i just feel it need a little balance 
I haven’t spend anything on the game and I don’t know if my opinion counts, but there is something that has been irritating me since the start. In raids, I think the mana of the heroes you attack regenerates too quickly. I use a rainbow team of 4* with around 3 300 power and most of the time I get paired with 5* heroes that fill their mana quickly and kill me with their more powerful specials. I don’t care about trophies or leaderboards, just filling the chest. Though lately, I’ve had more luck since I now use both Kiril and Melendor and with two healers it’s more manageable.
Also in wars, it would be pretty cool if after an enemy is defeated their next line up is not the same. Like you can’t use 1 hero twice in an attack. I think it should be the same for defence. I have 4 teams of 3* stars with around 2 400 power and these get slaughtered in the later stage of war when only teams with 3 000+ power remain.
So yeah, my two suggestions are:
- No super fast mana in raids
- Different defence teams in wars
BTW I’m curious what do people think of the arrows/ healing in wars? Yesterday I got pretty mad with the healing one- three 3* heroes couldn’t do enough damage to a single 5* who just kept endlessly regenerating health.
If the new heroes were different, but not a half-notch better, than TC20 heroes, then I wouldn’t have a problem with them being behind a paywall (effectively). But that’s not what top teams run, because nearly all of the top heroes are non-Classic.
Here was my alliance’s defense recently:
Which Classic heroes did we use?
Sartana: 15
Lianna: 3
Magni: 3
Marjana: 2
Justice: 1 (and only because we use yellow tanks)
So five of the twenty TC20 legendaries are represented, and only Sartana often (50% of the teams). The others are on 10% or fewer of the defenses. In fairness, Joon is under-represented in this sample because we use yellow tanks, and he’s low on the list of good yellow tanks. Still, that’s just 16% of the used defensive heroes that are Classic, although they represent about one-third of the available 5* heroes and are the most readily available ones.
How does this tie back to the trend towards negativity?
A year ago a (notional) similar screenshot would show a different picture. Sure, we’d have seen a lot of Alberichs, Ares, and Athenas in a top alliance, but day-to-day raiding was mostly my Tc20 heroes versus yours; the event/HotM heroes were icing on the Classic cake. Today, though, if you’re not running the elite of the special heroes, it’s easy to feel left behind.
I’m not sure how to fix this, though.
Of course your opinion definitely counts as much as anyone else here, but as mentioned above we are trying to keep to the topic of the the forum itself and the relationship between players and staff, rather than in-game grievances.
Here are a couple of threads that might interest you though
I agree. That’s way i think the game needs some balance. The old heroes need a buff. Something to make them able to compete with atlantis heroes and hotm. I’m tired of seeing guin tanks 
Considering what the v20 heroes balancing is it going right now, it won’t happen.
I just hope the old hotm and atlantis heroes will be added to tc20+ at some points, but that hope is becoming smaller every update they releasing
I was hoping for that too. I keep dreaming that at the end of atlantis all the heroes will be added to tc 20. Chances are slim to none probably 
I think wars would be fairer if when a defence team is beaten that team is gone forever and it respawns a second defence team. We use 6 attack teams but only have one defence team. Another option would be field layouts. You have to hit the front line to get to the second line. So you can put strongest teams in alliance on front line and only hit the person behind if you take out the one in front first. This means to get to the weakest in the alliance you have to go through the strongest and before respawn. Makes strategy and timing more interesting than it is now.
Just my three pence worth
I have never seen a forum set-up with no community coordinator/manager that is employed by the Developer. I have never seen forum moderators do so much leg work for a company that apparently doesn’t speak to them.
I have never seen outages as frequent or as long as the ones that occur here that the developer doesn’t directly respond to.
I have never seen a player base stand to be neglected this much.
My account is only 2 months old. I am a “money player” in every game I play/played.
I bought the starter pack and won’t be spending any more. Reading around in here tells me all I need to know.
Thanks.
This makes me happy. I understand the format may limit discussion, but it would be nice - if SG does not plan to improve their communication in some way - to hear exactly what their rationale is for keeping matters as they are. Maybe they don’t believe there is a problem, or maybe they think that increasing engagement would have a negative effect. Whatever their answer, I’d like to be able to understand their thinking.
Your opinion counts just as much as anyone else and it’s great that you are sharing it here. This thread, however, is pretty specifically targeted at the reasons players have become a bit less positive in the forum in recent times. The feedback you have provided is more general commentary on the game.
If you do a bit of a forum search you’ll find discussions both of defence mana charge rates, and also of suggested improvements to wars, including field aid and those cute little arrows. I feel like your input might fit quite well with those conversations.
Edit: Sorry - @MantisToboggan already said exactly this. My fault for not reading all new posts before replying.
My bad. I thought if people win more often they would be more positive. Missed the part about the forum and the relationship between devs and players. Though I have to say this community is surprisingly civil and mature. I’ve played quite a bit of online shooters and the amount of toxicity in games life Battlefield is quite high.
Thank you
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