Why I'm considering to quit playing / why I think the game is moving towards p2w

And why people do elemental summon if they just have to wait that a tc20 give them the same heroes?

Seriously, i don’t understand why getting the same normal 5* heroes of spenders via tc20 it’s ok, but event heroes and/or a HotM not.

Exactly like in elemental summon, you save time and get what you want immediatly.
Why F2P can’t have them like 6 months after? (nearly the same time you skipped to build a tc20?)

What’s worst is that this limited time heroes are the best and/or stack in the best way possible.
Were they “normal” no one care about don’t get them.

If only spending players get everytime the best, that is P2W.
You can’t name it in any other way.

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I agree with this and feel so strongly that I finally created a profile vs. just lurking on this forum.

I’m not a F2P player because I’ll jump on the cheap offers they put up in the game. It makes it a bit more fun and, when needed, I can drop some gems to get to a level or even try my luck at an event summon.

That means I’m a very low stakes P2W player, and I identify more with the F2P because I’m limited in both my budget and time. I just can’t play for hours in a day. However, I do try to jump in a couple of times a day. When I do come in and there is an event, I want to feel like it’s going to be enjoyable for me too. If that changes, I know I’m going to fade out of this game. On the beginner level of this event, the last stage is stacked with three 5-star heroes. This trio of heroes is almost impossible to beat, which is just discouraging.

I think the devs need to really be concerned about balance.

Of course, people willing to spend big should get the perks associated with that, but those players with less time and money should also be able to enjoy the game: the raids, the events, the challenges, and have fun leveling up their heroes and seeing positive results from putting in time and effort. This event is discouraging on that front.

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Because none of us can get infinite 4* ascension materials: that is the gatekeeper and what prevents the “whales” from winning.

All facets of the game have to be looked at, there’s no content F2P people can’t access, and you can break 100k (aggregate hits) just by being F2P pretty easily on a 10*, and Loorts has a nasty habit of outdamaging me I suspect on a semi-regular basis.

I’m just not buying the argument that this game is substantially P2W: that gets thrown around here a lot, compare to Lords Mobile or Game of War or Monster Strike or others.

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It’s less about the game being P2W already, and more about the direction it seems to be heading.

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How does a F2P game of this nature make enough money to support the developers and therefore get enough features? The advertisements don’t cut it.

If the complaint is about the event heroes, that have to be enticing enough to get them to spend, fine. These are the first new ones added in three months since we had two repeats… and a bunch of limited spenders or even F2P people who saved gems got it, same way many F2P players have HOTM’s.

End of the day, if you or anyone else can come up with an alternative model for SG to make money I’m absolutely certain they will listen to it… and the fact that the F2P players who are complaining who have gotten enormous enjoyment (apparently) out of this game for zero money invested, well, that’s their decision, but I think it’s short-sighted.

If anything the spenders that spend hundreds of dollars and get maybe one 4* event hero, that’s a bigger problem in my estimation. A number of people who were spending, probably aren’t going to be after this event… there’s a good chance I’m one of them.

Ultimately I don’t see a resolution to this short of a different revenue model; I understand the viewpoint but I still maintain that ascension items are going to keep it from being problematic for probably another six months to a year. If at that time there’s still a problem, if some people have now gotten 2 years of free play, I have a hard time in understanding how those individuals have been wronged.

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If the ascension materials are the thing holding back all the spenders, then why not change the hero purchases from a BS lottery draw to something actually gives value (i.e. buy a 5 star out of the 5 star pool, not some random 3% chance at a 5 star)?

People aren’t against spending money, but recently, at least for me, the value of $ spent isn’t there. I did 130 pulls during last guardian event. The usable heroes I got were Jackal and Joon. Good heroes no doubt, but 13 10x worth of $ (that’s $338 at the rate of $100/10k gems), no. Oh I also got unusable Guardian Kong and Owl. Contrast the playability of those cards with Panther. Panther is a top tier A+ card. I did 140 pulls this month and got Lancelot Merlin Natalya and a bunch of crap I already had. luckily most of that was from iTunes Gift cards. Next month, I won’t be shelling out $100-$200 for 3* and 4* fodder.

I would pay $100/month for new heroes I didn’t have. I’d prepay $50/month for 12 months upfront. At least then I know that I’d be getting something new and usable for my money. For a player who has been playing awhile and has all the four stars and understands many of the 5’s aren’t competitive heroes, the bulk of what you get for your $ just isn’t worth it anymore.

Do you think you’d get more $ of the the lower-middle of the spending base if you could pay $X and only pull from the 4 fours, or the 5 stars? People are willing to spend more if there’s a higher or guaranteed chance at value.

Why not a subscription service? $50/month gets you 2-4 new four star heroes, $100/month gets you the 4’s plus the 5’s.

EDIT: created a thread in the Ideas section here if anyone wants to discuss that model. Subscription service for new heroes

I already said this, 6 months delay.
While as you stated ascending materials are the bottleneck, getting this hero 6 months before will lead spenders of 6 months of better score in the event and better loot tier on titans (and better rank if you want it)
So basically? More ascension items.
6 months of it, how much advantage you all need good god? Forever? C’mon.

Why big spenders that already has great team bother to spend much more if they don’t value this new heroes as “essential”.
Yes, good player may still be competitive, but never on top and you know that. I know that. We all know that.
And a good player that can be beat by a mediocre one just due to his wallet is even more annoying.

Oh, and the 6 months delay doesn’t mean “Hey, 6 months has passed, give me my HotM!”
Nope. Training is not that easy, don’t need to tell you. You may still have to wait months before get what you want.

Really, all i need is a chance. Just a little chance.
Being hopeless really take away all the will to play.

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@Revelate
Think the last time you checked may have been the last of my glory days :wink:

In all seriousness though, I’ve had a couple of months of playing time advantage over most players - and I used to be better in strategy. Now that most of the members in my alliance have caught up on both of those I am struggling to get to top 5 on a good spawn time. In a bad spawntime I’m middle of the pack. My saving grace is that from the beginning onwards I have always leveled heroes that were good for titans rather than for raids etc. Also I definitely have to use items in order to get decent scores… they’re 40% of what made me be competitive in titan scores (and part of why i love scarlett) anyways.

why would people spend as much event money if the equivalent heroes were available via TC?

To either have them 6 months earlier, or to have the better version of them (see both of my original suggestions). If there would be a trainable 4* blue hero with colour defense debuff, people would still prefer Arthur. He would still give an edge over the 4* that paying players might think is worth paying for.

I don’t really agree with your argument on ascension materials, look at jackall and falcon. Their materials are easy to get (when you’re playing actively and are killing 10* titans regularly) and when they are maxed they are an absolute benefit in the titan teams. I’m fairly certain that Arthur on 3^70 would be pretty damn useful as well - I know Athena was and you don’t take her to the fight for her stats either.

Not saying I want the exact equal set-up. Not saying the game has done me wrong or that I didn’t get my entertainment out of it. I just start to realize that the direction the game is going to is one where I, as a non-spending player, can’t compete anymore. Since I could in the past that is a different gaming experience, and one I don’t like. Not trying to shame E&P for their business model or anything - just wanted to share my observations and see if I’m the daft person. Judging by the amount of responses I feel like I am not the only one who feels this way.

(and to move on to your next post, figure i should do this efficiently)

I appreciate all the praise :wink: But 100k on a 10* is usually about the amount of damage every player would have to do if you divide the titan equally. 100k aggregate is not spectacular, but I disagree that it is very easy for a f2p player to get to this stage. I know I don’t know a lot of f2p people that beat 10*s regularly - but that might be me :slight_smile:

I agree that it is not p2w in the way GoW is and I hope it will never be. My post was to indicate a trend towards more p2w - I know the developers regularly read forum posts and have a pretty solid record of listening to concerns. I personally hope they reconsider the direction they will take their game for my selfish gaming pleasure. If they don’t then I have obviously enjoyed the game tremendously in the past year, but then it is time for me to move on.

Lastly, I agree with Elpis. Adding heroes to the TC20 after 6 months doesn’t equal that you get them instantly. You’re limited to 2 tries a day (on average) max if you have all your camps only using this training. So far I have gotten 3 5* heroes out of 115 tries. Considering the chances of also pulling a guardian owl, guardian kong, pirate sargasso, or a Thoth - I don’t see how this would unbalance the benefits for a paying player.

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Hey now, no need to diss poor Thoth like that :frowning: I’m still trying to believe he can be useful…

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Hahaha sorry Ellilea! :smile:

If it makes you feel any better… i have a guardian owl, so at least he’s more useful than that :wink:

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That’s… a very low hanging bar you’ve got there :owl:

Few raids ago I actually faced a maxed Owl. Killed 4 of his mates and was like, “oh, I’ll see the ultimate power, wonder if I’ll get rekt!” but a stray tile finished him up in the same combo that got him charged. Like the end of an anime villain.

But one day he shall charge in time. I’m sure. One day.

Titans…meh. 29/30 times you get crap loot anyway. :grin:

Also, I have Guardian Owl. He is quite idle.

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I totally agree with this point, but I would like to identify two problems.

  1. Since all the draws are random, it’s very difficult to find a middle ground between F2P and P2W. If I could budget $10 or $20 dollars towards this game every month and know I would get some sort of advantage, I would do that. But it feels to me like money doesn’t get you much unless you’re willing to keep spending until you get what you want. This leads into:
  2. SG isn’t transparent with the probabilities of pulling a 4*, 5*, 4* event, or 5* event hero, or 4* troop. While I know that some community members have approximated these probabilities by collecting a lot of data from their experience, most players (customers) aren’t given full information on what they are buying.
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Wharf,

this is why I suggested in the Ideas section a subscription service, where for $20/month, you’d be guaranteed a random 4* or two. Or something to that effect (dollar amount and exact thing to get delivered TBD) where you’d pay X every month and get something you know can make your team better, as opposed to 6 Friar Tucks and 4 Valens.

Because there are a LARGE number of casual spenders, or those who would casually spend, IF (big IF here) that $10 or $20 was guaranteed to bring them some value.

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I don’t like the idea of a subscription, because that becomes some sort of a financial obligation which, in case of a game like this, just rubs me the wrong way.

As someone who can spend 10$ or 20$ on a game (it has more value in my currency sadly, so not as much a pocket change) one month, but definitely not the other, it’s just a bit nose-wrinkling.

Not to mention the longer you played the higher your subscription would have to become, because 4* rolls become quite useless quite fast, causing some sort of monetary snowball.

On top of it, it’s even more P2W from then on.

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I remember when my friend showed me this game, I became a fan when I learned more about it and saw that rare stuff could be obtainable for free but obviously grinding hard, I don’t see that nowadays on many games, props to SG for that.

As a F2P myself I understand that P2W players are sustaining this game, and I like the balance between F2P and P2W that exists right now, but I’m very concerned the direction this game is taking lately with these events and it’s exclusive imbalanced heroes…

One more thing I would have to mention that surprised me is SG actually listening to its community and try please by offering Rare quests more often when ppl were complaining/requesting, I hope SG listens this time as well.

The idea of having event heroes and Hotm available after 6 months trainable in TC 20 would maintain this current balance stable, even paying people would agree to this because there are investors out there that are extremely unlucky with the pulls and even if they miss out that month at least they have hopes of pulling the hero from Training Camp 20.

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I agree. I do spend fairly freely,but it doesn’t bother me at all if heroes i “paid” for are available with a lag. Getting a jump is a sufficient premium. You know that the P2P folks will still want the new shiny toy ASAP.

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My wish is that they would add 3* and 4* heroes to the regular pulls, and not just have event heroes and HOtM that disappear forever. Like they did with Friar Tusk and Little John. These guys had different specials too. It should happen here and there. Add a new regular hero to the roster and keep the game refreshing for all.

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Not when we’re talking marginal improvements.

To entice them to roll they’re going to have to introduce even more absurd heroes than the ones being complained about recently.

That may have to happen anyway, I don’t know… but I think everyone here vastly understates even the whales’ willingness to try to have every shiny new toy.

Also the fact that F2P players are walking around with HOTM’s and Guardian Owls among other things, color me skeptical of this needing to truly be fixed as long as some semblance of game balance is actually kept.

I have no shiny HOTMs. I don’t think I’m owed any. I certainly don’t need every hero that comes out on display. I only want a few I can love and call my own. :grin:

Can I pick those few? A la carte? grins

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