What to do against Miriam and Waterpipe defenses 🦊

[vanZille]

Seeing so much frustration against miriam tanks, especially in combination with bastet/panther, Anne of course and Aluhut. Here are my thoughts and teams i use against these. Of course the board is deciding but seeing a lot not even managing to get them down with all skills loaded,

Against miriam

Against miriam for example. Gobbler is healer too, taunt and fast mana control, since miriam defenses are fast, waddles is great, his mindless attack comes around when used on tank for example, loading tiles against tank then, wish i had more waddles.

I pair grimble with alfrike, if he is full then alfrike will be too in same turn. Even with bastets dodge on, alfrike should hit some targets, my minions and dodge giving some time at best always of course, not using that on a d with aluhut in of course, but even that can work

Against waterpipe there are a few nullifying his minions skill, red hood, baldur.

Loki is a great one to go against either miriam or waterpipe d too, so much to copy on those defenses that can turn the fight to my favor depending ion situation.
Here are some others i find useful

JF against the panther, ferant and aluhut for obvious reasons, jade too (mana cut, control is what gives time and time is needed on those) amoenna to heal, def up and break Anne etc chain at best. There are others useful too like snow white, khufu (best paired with grimble too like any slow one)

Overall fast mana control, dodge, taunt, minion killing is whats needed imo. Hope that makes sense, still at first coffee, day just started. So these are a few ideas, would like to hear yours too since those defenses will be with us for quite some time

[kylenguyen]

The problem of Miriam is her hp boost and berserke buff. Flank heroes will be a deadly cannon to your team before you take an action. Clearing minion is just a soft counter because if you fires after Miriam 1-2 turns, they still stand with a ton of hp.
About Waterpipe, the good counter is charge mana heroes i guess. His minion just prevent you to use special skill when your mana bar is full. Topaz/Ruby is good against him.

[dansing]

You have the heroes, I use to deal with M&M.

I use Hatter - El Naddaha - Alucard combo with other heroes as per need.

• Heimdall - Gazelle - Hatter - LoLo / Alucard - El Naddaha is the team I use most times.

• Yes, M&M is tough but not that crazy…. & of course a bad RNG day can be a spoiler….

For Waterpipe, I use the same team as above…
&
Have just completed NyX ….and have to try her out on him….coz, she will survive the 5% mana reduction….if I get her to the 2nd charge…

• She charges in 6 tiles & hits all in 1st charge = enough to remove all minions….unless opposite is loaded with minions…

[Oriontron]

I have been using Waddles. He is RnG based, on successive hits, but the initial hit you pick. So as always if you can get your tiles first, then any counter works, otherwise try again next time…

[vanZille]

Forgot some since i dont have them, like bera, think shes great too, problem is aluhut then, really tricky.
Like mentioned by @dansing the ones overcharging like ninja/magic etc heroes are perfect on Waterpipe, but these seem even harder to get than the ones I have, at least for me

[dansing]

The 2 StyX fellows = Nyx & the fire fellow “HIT ALL” on charge one (6 tiles)…. which is a big help to clear all minions…

Most other ninjas & magic hit all on last charge….which takes time…

[jkdevore]

This is really simple. Go with a 3-1-1 with green bring the 3. The other 2 are Grimble and Bera. If either of them go off, you’re pretty much SOL unless you can get Bera off 1st and in emergencies s, Grimble

[rho]

Waterpipe I don’t really have the right counters (mostly Bera), so it’s just using a green stack with 2 vf heroes (Athos, Kai) along with Guan Yu to try and take him out ASAP. Though @dansing proposed a creative solution with Nyx above, which I do have, so might try that out at some point.

M&M I think I’ve got her mostly figured out, my now standard M&M team is cKiril-Frida-cSkadi-Alucard-Ogima. Somewhat counterintuitively, this team actually works best when M&M has fired once, because the “gimmick” here is to use her minions against her, and put some frost+mana slow stacks on her with cSkadi. cKiril flips the berserk and gives a nice DD on top, then Frida dispels the HoT and piles on EDD. Short of withstand/evade, cSkadi kills her minions 100% of the time.

Alucard and Ogima are obviously the two off colors for clearing her minions in case the opening is bad, and Ogima also gives some nice mana slow stacks to the whole team.

(sometimes I struggle between bringing Frida or Krampus, because Krampus offers protection against dangerous flanks like Khufu or Anne, but then I can’t do anything about the HoT, which is what gives the flanks survivability. Though I could always ditch cKiril and just run Krampus-Frida-cSkadi instead… )

(fwiw, cKiril with 2x CB is actually tankier than Frida)