Trophies & Permanence - a rewarding PvP system with more depth and climb incentives idea (even without extra loot)

Due to the new updates there’s plenty of discussion about the trophy system. I would like to pick your mind about one thing that stands out to me as severely missing and - perhaps - a way to remedy a lot that is plaguing the E&P raid system.

And that is permanence.

An actual climb that you set out on and continue over the course of X months; the feeling of PROGRESSION.

Right now it goes as follows:

  • gain trophies to cross a threshold
  • open a better chest
  • see your rank for 5 seconds
  • see your new frame for a moment, be amazed… pff
  • close the game and go back to square one, rinse and repeat

There is no progression, there is no climb. Your general placement is more or less decided by the power of your defense team, meaning you will hover in the range of 300 points +/- for months on end.

It’s a never-ending yoyo effect and everyone who has tried to lose weight in their life knows how pointless it feels to try when yoyo effect gets your butt every time :wink:

I think MOBA games got it right.
You cannot lose your own progression over night due to other players/RNG factors. You CAN get dethroned due to other players overtaking you in the higher tiers, but you CAN climb or fall based on your own merit.

I think such a system would need a little adjustment to work with E&P, but here’s what I’d propose:


  1. Create a bunch of actual tiers, let’s connect them to the existing arenas.
  • BRONZE ARENA - 1* 2* 3* 4* 5* tiers {to keep the E&P starring spirit}
  • SILVER ARENA - 1* 2* 3* 4* 5* tiers
  • GOLD ARENA - 1* 2* 3* 4* 5* tiers
  • DIAMOND ARENA - 1* 2* 3* 4* 5* tiers
  • ETHERIUM ARENA - 1* 2* 3* 4* 5* tiers
  • EMPEROR’S COURT {or whatever lol, just going by EMPIRES & Puzzles n’all}

The Arenas:

Once you reach a new Arena, you cannot be demoted from it, your cups are permanently locked at the minimum required for the given tier.

Let’s take a newbie player as an example, call him Bane Master.

Bane Master installs the game. He reaches level 4 and unlocks raids. BM gets placed at 0 cups in Bronze Arena 1*.

Bronze Arena:

  • entry requirement: 0 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 100 cups, 3* = 200 cups, 4* = 300 cups, 5* = 500 cups

Bane Master starts to play and he reaches 100 cups. He gets promoted to tier 2*. Whee!

And so:

  • The first time he enters a new tier he gets a small reward in Ham and Iron. Whee
  • His “wanted chest” gets a little bit of a boost/gets a bit worse as he moves up and down the Bronze tiers. 5* gives better than 1*, 3* is average for Bronze Arena etc, right?
  • He gets a new _permanent _ frame/symbol on his portrait

Then, Bane Master finally gets a team good enough to get 600 cups!

He is given an invitation to the Silver Arena. If he accepts, he is matched vs. his own mirrored team (for fun, it’s always fun to meet yourself, AND it also prevents any sort of unlucky matchups!).

If he wins, he enters Silver Arena with 600 cups entry point.

Bane Master’s cups are now LOCKED at 600.
He will not be able to go below that, whether by being attacked at night or by losing matches on his own.

Which means that his ACTIVE PLAY was rewarded and his progress will not be reverted by enemies at night.

Now he still needs to keep his defense team up to par or he might be getting rolled back to 600 cups! And his goal is to reach the Gold Arena.

The process is just the same, but Bane Master has a clear goal. Gold Arena wanted chests are better, and if he will try to claw his way up there, he will get to have a guaranteed better gains - but he will also be facing stronger opponents.

The choice is his - he can reject the Arena Invitation and stay in Silver tier for as long as he feels he wants to. But if he reached the invite, it’s likely he belongs higher :unicorn: He EARNED it.

Bronze Arena:

  • entry requirement: 0 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 100 cups, 3* = 200 cups, 4* = 300 cups, 5* = 500 cups

Silver Arena:

  • entry requirement: 700 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 800 cups, 3* = 900 cups, 4* = 1000 cups, 5* = 1100 cups

Gold Arena:

  • entry requirement: 1200 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 1300 cups, 3* = 1400 cups, 4* = 1500 cups, 5* = 1600 cups

Diamond Arena:

  • entry requirement: 1800 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 2000 cups, 3* = 2200 cups, 4* = 2400 cups, 5* = 2600 cups

Etherium Arena:

  • entry requirement: 2800 cups
  • tier requirements: 2* = 3000 cups, 3* = 3200 cups, 4* = 3400 cups, 5* = 3600 cups

The larger gaps between tiers in Diamond and Etherium arena would prevent players from easily climbing to the next tier on a few flasks while disregarding their defense teams. It’s supposed to take a little while unless someone wants to use 100 flasks. Well, if they wanna, they gonna, that’s the way of E&P. That’s how everything works here anyway.

That being said, the numbers are just examples! Maybe the larger gaps wouldn’t be needed at all, but I do think the cup thresholds would change in this system and arenas so 3600 cups might be fine. I don’t know, I just want to depict what I mean in general terms :unicorn:

The issue with cup dropping would largely disappear in this sytem, because players would be matched only with others in the same arena or tier (probably depending on the number of players). That’s possible with the proposed permanence - this way matchmaking is still based on cups not team power, but teams are kinda-sorta sorted by team-power and player skill.

That would also remove a LOT of the horribly uneven fights - unless someone WANTED them and climber the tiers like mad. That would be the player’s choice though. That’s why ascending a tier should be a CHOICE. If someone feels they belong in X-cup range, let them be there, harmlessly. If someone wants to push to a too-high tier to get the entry reward/frame/better chests at the cost of being matched with stronger people all the time - that’s their CHOICE.

It’s unlikely such a choice would come randomly as climbing up through the tier would require a team or skill. And the Arena Invitation could also come with a warning that teams up there will be tougher and the player can advance when they feel ready. It could add some thrill to the whole thing as well. You know, the


If someone regrets their choice they could make a different one next season.

Strongest players would have no reason to drop cups, as they’d have to reject promotions to be at low cups. The extent of cup dropping would be limited to within the given arena - and that’s a way more fair fight.

Sure you could just have an amazing team and stay in Silver, but that would mean the player gives up on good rewards for the sake of trololing. And I think that should be their right, really.

Now our friend Bane Master has actually built an amazing team, his defense is stellar, he’s reached the top of Etherium court and he really wants to fight with the best of the best for some serious piece of glory.

Upon reaching tier 5* in Etherium Arena for the first time, instead of a regular level-up reward (or alongside it), BM would get a chance to participate in the Emperor’s Court.

A 100 players can be fighting in the court at any given time. By winning fights against the other Courtiers ( :stuck_out_tongue: ) he gets more cups, and to enter the Court, he has to defeat the courtier with the lowest amount of cups. After that you get random adversaries from the court.

Now, the fun part is, you get a juicy statistic telling you how many days you’ve been in the court - a total, and the longest streak.

At the end of the season, the top courtiers - those that have been there the longest-standing courtiers could get some neat avatars or some such.

This should ensure that the top dogs always have something to do and staying in top 100 actually matters. Climbing the ladder would also ensure they don’t get booted and lose their streaks! Competitive fun for the most competitive bunch, I think.

Ending words

I think these mechanics pretty much base on most of the systems E&P already has so they wouldn’t be too hard to implement.

I also think it will never happen cause LUL forums suggestions :scream_cat:

It was fun to write though while waiting to get sleepy! :grin:

Yes, I’m sure the system has faults! Feel free to discuss, I did just make it up on the spot (basing strongly on what I’ve seen in competitive games, of course, not discovering any Americas here).

But I do think it would solve the most jarring problems and gripes people have with raiding.

I also wanted to add one more thing, but completely forgot what it was meanwhile. Wheops.

EDIT: Right, seasons.

Seasons could be anything. One year. One real-life season (Spring, Summer, Fall, Winter). That could certainly remove the stagnation from the raids area of the game and make it more dynamic.


I really, really love it.

It’s beautiful and awesome and beautiful.

It’s a long read, too, and I need to go through it more thoroughly at some point. But I wanted to say I really appreciate the idea, the way you explained it and broke it down, and I really think it’s a solid foundation for raids.

Thank you


Well, thanks for the kind words :sunny:


Great post, great Idea which deserves more attention.


I really like this idea, I’ve seen similar systems used in other games and it made it fun. I would certainly participate more if it was restructured, at least to give it a shot.

My only concern is that trophies operate a lot like the federal reserve now… All trophies are accounted for and how more are added is pretty murky at best. Never dropping below a certain threshold would actually likely require a large overhaul of the current coding - so even if they also like this idea, the development team would need to work on this for months before introducing it to beta.


The idea worths every second you spend reading it. Absolutely brilliant and far more interesting than the current (ultra-boring) (ultra-repetitive) raid system.

Not sure at all if something like that could even be implemented, but it would be awesome. Thumbs up!


With the amount of money SG gets from this game, they could probably turn it into The Elder Scrolls VI :rofl:. I’ve heard it’s the most profitable game in the store currently (mobile games store, of course)? Or maybe it’s just a rumor.


Love love love love this! Two paws waaay up! :heart_eyes_cat:


Well thought out idea. Thumbs up!


Thanks guys. Even though I know it’s for naught, it’s really nice to hear/see that you like the ideas :blush:


I second the motion to move this to Ideas & Feature Requests! I want to vote for this…


Well thought out and expressed ideas - thank you for posting them. I think I need to read them again (maybe more than onece) before I have any kind of properly though out opinion, but my knee jerk reaction is that your system seems very appealing.

Thanks again for making the effort to create this thread.

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moved :slight_smile:

EDIT: This idea can now be voted on.


You always have the best ideas and i totaly in love with this one.

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Oh no, the topic got moved to the scary dark place where topics go to die! :scream: :rofl:

Thank you, that’s really sweet of you to say! :relaxed:

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I love this idea :blush: Well thought out @Ellilea
I may have more comments when I read it again, it deserves more than a quick read-through.

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There is absolutely nothing left to add to this Idea other than a completion date. This would not only work, but would bea Major attracting feature of this game.


WOW!! You really are a whiz, Eli! You should part of the Devs team…I love the way you broke the system into brackets…so much better for everyone! I hope the Devs listens to your idea and implements if not all, at least parts of it!


This is seriously an excellent idea, well thought out and articulated. This will make raiding a lot more fun


I think the idea is brilliant. I don’t know how much it will affect cup scores to make a change like this.
My only comment is that cup score in the Etherium arena seems to be very high. After the online revenge on leaderboard was implemented it is rare to see scores of more than 28-2900 cups on the top 5 spots.
But it is a detail really…

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