Tournament algorithm needs adjusting

So, flushed out of the tournament, which I expected. What I didn’t expect is how.

The penultimate team was 4041, while my attacking team is around 3900. Not a great board, and I lost.

And then instead of dropping me to a lower point adversary, I get this:

So 75 points higher.

Even if that second team somehow lost more, it’s a simple check for team strength to avoid this. It’s bad enough that a win jumps you 200-300 strength while a loss only drops you 100, to allow for a stronger opponent is absurd.

Not the first time it’s happened, but the worst I’ve seen so far.

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It’s unfortunately not quite so clear cut and dry as being simply TP.

The assigned strength of an enemy team is not solely dependent on the TP of the team. It also factors in how that defence team has been performing in the tournament…

So without having the respective defence ratings of both enemies it’s Hart to 100% say for sure one way or the other what’s happened.

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I think it is not at all depending on the defense team(power) but on the five strongest heroes in the roster that someone COULD field for the defense team.

At least that is what SG clarified to be the main factor for matchmaking.

Furthermore you can expect that the farer you get in tournament the more beefy your opponents get. And as you get 200+ points for the defeat - it is like getting further

That is the case for your initial matchmaking… Matches your first fight or two against an enemy defence team of comparable strength to the best 5 heroes available that you could use.

After the first couple it’s more dependent on your performance (moving you up and down)

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The difference in your case is minimal. Mine was 500-600 TP difference. TP doesn’t matter that much, but heavily emblemed enemys do. It was too much for me, because I am out. The difference is going way too fast up…

Yes. Performance. Like getting more points. But not the teampower of the defteam as you said earlier. That number is not included in matchmaking afaik.

And it needs to be. Because this is ridiculous.

In normal raids I often reroll, if my team is stronger or I’m looking for a stronger or even strongest war opponent.

Try to beat up not down. :wink:

‘Team Power’ has very little connection to actual team strength and is best ignored. If you’re paying attention to it then you’re looking at the wrong thing.

(Just for kicks, build a team from your heroes that maximises your Team Power. Now look at it. Rubbish, isn’t it? Couldn’t beat an egg, could it? Stop thinking team power matters: it doesn’t.)

Team Power is, as always, an abstraction. But it’s a useful one, and saying you should completely ignore it is laughable.

You’re speaking from a position of having a deep and powerful roster, which isn’t the state for most people. I’ve got a 4K team, sure, but only 1 or 2 heroes in each color that make that possible. The rest need emblems or levels to get anywhere close.

Again, there’s no good reason for a tournament loss to pit you against a team that is more powerful. Or even close to it.

Yes, there is. Tournaments are intended to sort participants by performance. How can we tell how players rank if they are only matched against opponents with comparable team power?

One should, of course, be matched against progressively tougher opponents until one repeatedly fails. And how to measure opponents’ toughness? By their record in the tournament to date.

Team power - almost meaningless at its best - is certainly irrelevant here, particularly given that tournament constraints render each hero’s colour and special of wildly varying impact. Insisting that tournament teams be matched by team power would be like insisting that tournament tennis players be matched by height - entirely inappropriate and an excellent way to frustrate the objective of the whole venture.

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Plus it adds the option of faking your defense team weak (use some unleveled or midleveled heroes) so you would only face unleveled teams…? Nah…

No, as has been said repeatedly, your first raid is based on the strength of the 5 highest eligible heroes.

Which may or may not be an awful team.

This is analogous to the seeding one is assigned at our tennis tournament - there is a good chance that it is nonsensical (seedings are often very silly) but it doesn’t really matter because your final placing will mostly depend on how you perform against progressively more accomplished opponents. Just as with raid tournaments.

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What about “who” attacks your defense? If I put three heavily emblemed “strong” heroes in the middle of my defense and a couple weaker or unemblemed on the wings (even though I COULD provide more heavily emblemed heroes there) do I get weaker teams attacking me? Experimenting, it seems I’m better off sandbagging a little on defense than trying to field my best. I have been doing much better sandbagging. Does anyone know for sure?

Initial attack is based entirely on team power.

After that it’s based on defense team performance. (Assuming attacker isn’t making first attack). Which is why I got the screwy matchup that started this post.

The problem with saying it’s purely based on your performance is that there’s a large amount of luck involved on the tiles. If you get a ton of the banned color, you’re likely to lose even if you’re the best player out there. Over time that will even out, but that’s not how tournaments in this game work.

I don’t know what you’re trying to say, here.

I also don’t know what you’re trying to say here.

This bit I understand but don’t entirely agree with. Of course you might get a lot of tiles of the banned colour - it’s likely to happen more than once in the course of a tournament. But this will happen to most people, to varying degrees, and if you’re lucky it will happen to you less than it happens to others.

And even when you do have to deal with those troublesome boards, you should be able to salvage some of those matches with a bit of tile juggling so that they’re not always fatal. There’s a little skill involved there.

Thousands of people are in tournaments each week. In my experience this happens to me all the time in 3* I be set up with teams round about my level will get 5-0.
Next day ok now they little tougher as expected with +5 +10 emblems on everyone will probably go 4-1 3-2.
Next day bang facing teams with +20 emblems on everyone how? in less than 15 matches this happens when thousands of people are playing?

If we are gonna talk about team power of opponents in tourneys, here is my log from the last one.

The TP went up when i win, usually by small margins (under 50), and on some occasions as large as 400 TP, and went down when i lose.

There are five occasions broke this pattern. Guess what? In all of them, TP went down even if i won (many of them are around 10 TP but one was 4283 to 4052 and another was 4152 to 4030).

So, there you go, your observations are anectodal and doesn’t qualify to assess how the matchmaking works.

The initial power of the opponents will be set according to your 5 best allowed heroes at the moment of joining.

Here are a few thoughts:

  • Remove emblems from allowed heroes, join and put the talents back in place after joining to face weaker opponents. Expensive, less points and no guaranteed winning.

  • Leave it like it is and meet tougher opponents to get more points. This one is the intended method and you may lose some more, but without any work and cheap.

  • Do not join at all. You won’t lose a single fight, but the loot will be very very crappy, too. :wink:

You decide & hopefully have fun.
Anything is better than nothing :wink:

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