Time Stop mana reduction and Ninjas?

How come this potion doesn’t work on ninjas? They suppose to lose 100% mana but they lose ony one layer of full mana. To me 100% mean and always will be FULL mana. If they have 3 stacks of mana 100% means they suppose to lose ALL mana not just one layer. Another BS.

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If they have 200%,
You’ll take away half;
That leaves 100%,
The ninjas will laugh.

If beyond the 2x charge,
Is the mana bar you see;
The only way to take it all,
Is with Time Stops Three.

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Thats not true. Potion says 100% mana. It doesn’t say one layer of mana. It doesn’t matter how many layers of mana they have, it’s stil a MANA.

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It doesn’t say enemies lose 200% mana.
Or enemies lose 300% mana.

Which is what these ninjas can collect…

So… -100%…

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The way numbers work,
Is an interesting thing;
The mana still lurks,
Even if Time Stops you bring.

Can be more than one,
This is definitely true;
Because adding one,
Will result in number two.

The same with percents,
Which work the exact same way;
It makes total sense,
Double and triple away.

'Cause if I have five,
Then double it up to ten;
What percent doth arrive?
Divide add two zeroes then.

Ten slash five is two,
Adding both of my zeroes;
Look at what they do!
Two hundred percent heroes.

Mana reducer,
Is still not going to do;
Cut twenty percent,
With a special from Li Xiu.

And then you will see,
If the mana bar was doubled;
The special still be,
Ready to cause you trouble.

Mana special is nice,
Just know it might not delay;
A hero charged twice,
Keep this in mind as you play.

The lesson is learnt,
I’m sorry that the way was hard;
I’m sorry you got burnt,
But, I hope you pull a ninja card.

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Potion says 100% mana. Card says 100% / 200% / 300% mana for the layers. Seems to be working as intended. Maybe not how you would like but as intended.

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Mama is still mana. If something says you lose all mana it DOESN’T mater how much mana you have. You lose it all and always. Because it call mana. Absolutely doesn’t matter you have 100,200,300%,because it still only mana. So you have lose all mana regardless on amount.

I’m not making my point so well in poem, so let me try it a different way:

ITEM: Time Stop

DESCRIPTION: All enemies lose 100% mana and have their normal attack delayed by 3 turns.

HERO: JADE

PARTIAL DESCRIPTION: Special Skill has a different effect when charged with 100%/200%/300% mana.

The problem here is that you’re thinking the mana should be a variable quantity and it’s a fixed quantity.

For example, if I have $100 and I get another $100, then I have doubled my money to $200, which is 200%.

Money is a variable quantity. That means that if you take away 100% of my $200, I will then have $0. That is absolutely correct.

However, the game is using a full mana bar as a fixed quantity.

One full mana bar = 100%.

If we use the $100 as a fixed quantity, then we will always be dealing in percentages of $100. If I have 300% of this quantity, then I will have $300. However, if you take away 100% of $100, I will still be left with $200.

Anyway, nothing about the Time Stop says you lose, “ALL mana,” it says you lose 100% mana. Essentially, it refers to 100% of a full mana bar.

5 Likes

One other thing:

The game has ALWAYS treated a mana bar as a fixed quantity; it is not different for the ninjas.

For example, Li Xiu’s special takes away 20% of a mana bar, regardless of how much mana an opposing hero actually has. In other words, if a hero has 50% of a mana bar, then they will have 30% of a mana bar after Li Xiu fires.

If instead Li Xiu only took away 20% of the mana that the 50% hero ACTUALLY HAS, then the hero would effectively lose 10% mana relative to the mana bar and be left with 40% mana. This is because 20% of 50% is 10%…but again, the game doesn’t work that way.

But, the full mana bar is a fixed quantity of mana, not a variable one.

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Ok so. In your logic. There is a hero with mana gain prevention. Dont now the name. So this skil suppose to prevent mana gain BUT only one stage of mana. Other stages suppose to gain mana as normal till this hero does use his skill again. Right? So instead of gaining 3 layers with this mana prevention debuff they suppose to gain only 2 stages. Right? Gggggggg

You’re dealing with an entirely different percentage in your question.

Heroes default to gaining a certain percentage of mana at a certain rate, which is the mana gain, “Speed.”

When determining how many tiles (and under what circumstances) it will take to fully fill a mana bar, it doesn’t actually come out to an exact calculation. It seems like it does, but it doesn’t, because most heroes cannot hold more than 100% mana…so any small amount of overage is just lost.

The difference with these heroes is that they can hold more than 100% mana, but not more than 300%, so the 300% special (if the hero is on defense) will automatically fire at the next available time as with any other hero who is at 100%.

When a hero casts an effect that slows down mana (and there are quite a few who do this) that just means that the contribution to the mana bar from tiles is reduced by that percentage.

For a simple example: Let’s pretend that hitting a defense hero with five tiles will fill exactly 50% of the mana bar:

If I have a hero that slows the rate of mana gain by 50%, then those five tiles will result in the hero gaining 25% of a mana bar…but the mana bar itself is not changed…only the amount of mana a hero actually receives has been changed.

In other words, using such a hero on a Ninja hero will always result in the Ninja hero gaining 25% of that mana bar…all other things equal. It wouldn’t matter what the Ninja’s current mana bar status is. It’s a totally different calculation and metric.

For proof that it does not change the mana bar itself…if one of these mana slow heroes hits you when you are on a quest, but then you use a 25% mana potion, your mana bar will still go up 25%.

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And 100% is still 100%, not 300%.

But hey, if you think it’s such a major issue then file a bug report. We’re all just players here with very little influence over the game direction … apparently.

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%100 = all. If you happen to have 2 glasses of water you don’t have %200 water you have two glasses each at %100 of capacity. If you lose %100 of your water you lose both glasses of water.

There is no such thing as %200, %300, …
As much as common usage might like to have it that way, that’s just not the case in maths.

Time stop should be reworded to “lose one complete charge of mana.”
Ninja charges should be reworded to “1 charge of mana, 2 charges of mana, 3 charges of mana.”

As they are both currently written the time stop should remove all mana regardless of the incorrectly labeled percentages.

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the description of time stops were written way before the ninjas were introduced, maybe some kind of clarification should be in order

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Exactly. I was pointing this couple month ago.

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Well actually you do have 200% x one glass in your analogy. Ninjas get three glasses each

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Back in the days when I was in school, in math class they taught us that 100% of 300% is actually 300% (100% of 1 is 1, of 2 is 2, of 3 is 3…and so on).
So, this either has to be fixed, or the description of the time stop has to be fixed.

I dont see any need to reword or need for fix here.
Ninjas works on charge, meaning they have the ability to gain 100% mana over 3 times rather than just one in the case of every non ninja hero. So time stop/ freeze will eat away 100% of that charge where they are currently. So if the ninja is in charge 3 and u fire it, he goes to charge 2. If he was already ready to fire in charge 3 (indicated by the mana bar blinking), even when u use timestop, he will go to 200% and still fire the next turn. It is how the mechanics work. I dont see anything broken.

Li Xiu is a hero that cuts 20% mana on all enemies. If the enemies have exactly 20%, she will reduce that mana to 0%. She will not take 20% of the 20% they already have (which would be only a 4% cut).

It’s the same for ninjas that can go up to 200% and 300%. If their mana is reduced 100% it will be for example 300%-100% or 200%-100%

I never had issues with the % applied to mana bar. Maybe a better word would be mana points. So ninjas can have up to 300 mana points and Time Stop cuts by 100 mana points.

You are mistaken.
I have 2 gasses filled to %100 of capacity.
I can increase the number of glasses of water that I have but I cannot increase the amount of water in any glass that is at %100 of capacity.
If I have 2 full glasses of water and I reduce the amount of water I have by %100 I will have none left. I will not have a single glass of water.

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