Tiles vs. Stacking

At this point I think we’ve all realized that the odds of getting the beneficial color tile have decreased based on the amount of like color heroes used during a raid, war, or Titan hit. This has yet to be addressed in the notes of any update, and I think it’s far past time it’s been acknowledged. Even if the devs aren’t willing to give out the algorithm, I think it’s only right that they give us the break point. What is the reduction in tile likelihood relative to the number of same-color heroes?

I think it’s only right that you give us the data you’re basing this realization on.

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Do you mean calculations? I mean, both words are acceptable, but only one is of value when speaking of actual data. As for the actual data, they’re all readily available in the math line group where we attempt to predict the algorithms.

Sorry, I was talking in a more general way. Maybe I should’ve said ‘present the data’, as in ‘present the data and your conclusions in a way that makes sense to and are testable by me/anyone’. Because we do not all share the realization you’re refrering to. I’m not saying you are wrong, just that I don’t see it.

Also, I wouldn’t call the ‘math line group where we attempt to predict the algorithms’ as readibily available – I have absolutely no idea of who ‘we’ are or what line group you are referring to. :wink:

Ah, my mistake. I guess I just assumed by your condescending speech pattern and holier than thou attitude that you had already been part of the larger conversation leading to this forum post. I apologize. What I meant by “readily available” is that the data are readily available to the users who have been charting and graphing this over the last several months. You are welcome to find me on Line and I’ll add you to the group.

Could you post some. I’m sure everyone would be interested and would be outraged if true since it directly contradicts SG’s statements. Right now it just sounds like conspiracy.

I have not been part of a/the larger conversation, but I’ve of course come across posts and threads bringing this and similar subjects up. I have yet to see (and I may have missed that) someone actually providing information confirming this. If it’s indeed a fact, it’s a rather big issue.

If you are keen on interpreting and analyzing language, you might want to think about what general statements like ‘I think we’ve all realized’ does for credibility, especially when not offering any form of supportive data for your conclusion*. Because this isn’t common knowledge. Referring to a Line group (or rather tell me to ‘find [you] on Line’) for more information doesn’t help that credibility.

If you want people to engage in this subject, which I assume you want as you’re posting here, you should provide that information.

* ‘present the data and your conclusions in a way that makes sense to and are testable by me/anyone’.

If there is indeed a well documented set of data that would back up your assertion, I would really love to see it.

In the interest of transparency, I am skeptical of your claims. I have seen a few attempts to prove that boards are non-random and have never seen a successful one. That, plus the developers’ claims, plus my experience as a game designer, plus a cursory understanding of confirmation biases lead me to my currently held belief that boards are in fact random and that color stacking does not affect tile distribution.

That said, I consider myself open-minded and curious. I’m eager to learn more about the game mechanics. For something like tile distribution, the data collection effort has been the barrier to me learning more. If someone has overcome that obstacle, I would be much obliged if that were shared.

Additionally, since you seem to be trying to call the devs’ bluff on this point, presenting them with your evidence would probably be the most effective way to do so.

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Riiiiiiiight. Always a classy way to win people over to your point of view…

And now for my own condescending speech patterns and holier than thou attitude: It’s a commonly accepted practice to present a summary of the data that you base your assertions on rather than assume that people are going to,

  1. Join a very narrowly focused Line chat group
  2. Read all the notes and whatever you’ve got stored there
  3. Dig in enough to understand what’s important in that [presumed] pile of data
  4. Reach the same conclusions you have arrived at

So maybe you ought to consider climbing down off that high horse and explain what leads you to these conclusions.

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I’m new(ish) to the game. Played for a couple months now.

I have to admit that the OP is touching on a subject that has crossed my mind more than once.

I can’t count how many times I have stacked heroes of a certain color, started the fight just to see a couple of those tiles on the board. It does ‘feel’ as if this is intentional being that it happens to often! However, when I take a rainbow team the tiles tend to be much more balanced.

Random is random, I get that. You will have boards that favor you and boards that want your heroes dead :slight_smile:

I understand the frustration of it for sure. Not saying I know one way or another about the algorithm being used. Figured my bad luck was the culprit, but have heard more than one person speak about this topic.

There was extensive research done on this question, presented in this thread:

Summary: player counted tile colors in two hundred consecutive boards, 100 consecutive boards with an unbalanced team, 100 consecutive boards with a rainbow team. The data do not support the hypothesis that tiles are weighted against the stacked colors.

There has not been a similarly rigorous study of whether the replacement tiles are random. SGG has told us they are, and it would take a lot of extra coding to unbalance them, and I can’t see why SGG would bother. But it hasn’t been tested, so I encourage anyone who wants to video capture tile drops using the same experimental design (200 raids, 100;with balanced team, 100 stacked), count tile replacement colors, and report the data.

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I’m all in favour of transparency for most aspects of the game, and I too believe that colour stacking does result in slightly unfavourable boards. I think. I’m not completely convinced, and I have no data to present to anyone because I simply don’t care, and have no interest in campaigning against it, but I’m curious as to why you seem to care so much.

First and foremost, regardless of the garbage you read across this forum, this is still a game, not an arithmetic exam, or an entrance into an abyss of depression as some would have you believe.

Do I expect to win every raid, or score 80k every titan hit? No.
Should I, for some reason? No.
Do I want some sort of challenge to keep me interested? Yes.

I get my fair share of god awful titan boards, but I also get my share of fantastic ones. The jury is out on them, but colour stacking with a bad board is still going to get me a higher score than going in rainbow.

Raiding is where the gripes start coming in though. As has been covered in various other threads, as the attacker I have all the power. When setting up a raid offence team, my priority is tank busting, I will take what I can to give me a 5 vs 4 advantage as quickly as possible, so generally in diamond it means I’m throwing in either 3 purple or 3 blue heroes and filling the gaps with whatever I feel like. Give me a board where tiles are evenly distributed right from the start and that raid is over in a few turns. You just cannot allow it to be that easy. I enjoy having to work for it. I should have to work for it, considering that only I can choose a line-up based on that particular raid, the defender cannot.

If SG released a new update saying “yep, you caught us breaking your colour stack boards, we will stop it or tell you a workaround” or even “we honestly don’t tamper with the board, but have put some code in place that guarantees an even board in every single raid” then I would be annoyed. I would wake up to 100% defeats every morning rather than an even split, and I would never lose an offensive raid again. The whole feature would be pointless, and I would just play a different game.

A post was merged into an existing topic: Unfair raids, stacking colors and no tiles