This game is built on frustration tactics and I hate it. I rage quit today

I’ve seen worse first posts than this.

Very well put, it’s nice to have new posters that can add to discussion, and welcome to the community!


Honestly the “tin foil hat” crowd of “the devs are out to get us” frustrate me. But so do the “its all fair and equal crowd”.

 We as humans tend to rely on math in these games to explain how it's fair.  If "x" action is completed 1 million times you get "y" result a known percentage of the time.  This is mathematically true and therefore a fact.  However people as individuals do not perform action "x" 1 million times and often do not experience the expected results of "y". 

 How can the devs create the balance between the overall average, a mathematical fact, and the individual experience?  When a game company solves that problem we will have the perfect game!

Thanks for the welcome to the forums post.


Very well said. The thing, in my understanding, is that so far developers don’t bother balancing the game because number of active players and spenders is big enough and all the haters can be considered “acceptable loss”. There are lots of proposals on the forum on how to mitigate the impact of “bad luck” fluctuations.

I died on Season 2 Hard Mode, on the last level 27-10 when fighting the boss and left her with 6000hp left.

spent about 10 minutes in that battle and only lost because yellow gems stopped coming, sweet spot hits stopped coming and the RNG was infuriating as the boss picked off my heroes one by one.

But, as a veteran of the game, I just needed to walk away and collect myself. Do something in real life for a bit.

The extremes of the RNG, as you say, are absolutely frustrating.


There always are. However they rarely, I have not read them all on this forum, take into account the reason for making a game. The company needs to make money. Most “mercy rule” suggestions I have read are too in favor of the player.

My suggestion is far too long to post in detail here but involves not a linear “gain” for those who have bad luck but an overall system of assigning “values” to things, hidden from players. This value creates the average for any item in the game. RNG would dictate the results of a given action and then “look up” the value/total value of the result. If the value was within a given range of the expected result the player would get the “result”. If the given value was extreme, too high or low, the devs could accept the result and apply a + or - to the next result for a given player of simply re-roll to achieve a known “average”. The + or - could be cumulative until the expected average is achieved on a per player basis but it would not create the I received subpar results “x” times so I know I will get superior results next time. This would allow for both good and bad luck but achieve the overall average for all accounts.

Of course there are upsides and downsides to every system and the above is a VERY short version of my envisioned system.

A simple system of " I get a 5 star every “x” number of summons" creates the P2W scenario. the complete RNG system of “x” chance to get a 5 star with every summon creates the lucky/unlucky system. Both are common suggestions in this and many other forums.

I do not believe the devs don’t bother balancing the system. I firmly believe that a fair and balance system has yet to be created and implemented by any gaming company. It’s not for lack of trying but the conflict of a perfect system vs the realities of producing a product that makes money in a timely fashion. Hence the answer of RNG!


One thing is certain. If on a roll × 10 “give the best value” should be a 5 *. Do not!?

For sure that are the desired ones. Sometimes luck was on my side, sometimes not. Since I know what I’m doing, I’d never come here to complain about not getting whatever. No matter what you get, it is and stays a game, nothing more nothing less.

Money is never gone at all, it’s just in another pocket. :wink:


imo not necessarily. RNG gives a game its flavor. If you always know the result of “I roll x10 and get the best result” the P2W always get the advantage since they can “buy” more rolls. The ideal for me is to get BOTH ends of the extreme, maybe you get 5* several times in a row, or get great results from a “chest” several times in a row but you also get the bad. So you would get a 3* several times in a row etc. However the overall average should be at or near the posted results for each individual player not averaged across millions of players! If you achieve the posted result averaged across all players in a game it means that nearly half achieved less than the posted results! This is what is unacceptable! Half of the people playing this game should not receive less than the posted rates and half should achieve above the posted rates to achieve this mythical average! Given a “reasonable” amount of time and effort every single player should approach the average posted rates. Now define reasonable amount of time and effort, because I can’t! That is left to the devs to decide.

As posted by many above, and probably below. Play the game as long as you enjoy it and then move on! Best of luck to all players in their endeavors!


I can understand that a company needs to make money. It takes money to have the right software engineers, project management, testing, marketing, executive management, etc. I just miss the days where you could purchase a game for some said price and become as good as you want to be in the game. I played Doom, Descent, and countless others for years after completing end game beause it was just a fun game to play with my friend. Paying for patches and content updates was never a problem for me. Paying a small amount of money each month to support service, is like paying for my cable TV and not a problem. But, this whole business model of advertising play for free in order to starve players of items they need just so they can pay a lot of hard earned money each month, sometimes days for an RNG based roll to possibly get items in game you need to be as good as you want to be in game is a bit on the pure business greed side. If I had bought all the items from this last Easter event daily sale. I would of easily spent $250 US in two weeks and not even been able to ascend one 5 star past it’s last level. I don’t mind the RNG aspect either. But, there should be higher percent chances on AM than for example Raid Tournaments where even the top 1% only have a 2% chance for a 4 star AM. Honestly, for the most part the only time I see 4 star AM it usually has a $7 or higher price tag associated with it.

You don’t have to…

…neither play nor pay.

Did you see this?


Or this one

Best f2p roster IN THE WORLD


Oh boy you done did it now. Lots of the old players will say oh sure give it to you for free, we didnt get it free. Then they will tell you how many MORE ways there is now to get ascension items now compared to back then. BUT the most of them will NOT tell you the items and epic coins fell WAY WAY more than now.
There is NO WAY to keep from grinding and spending many many hours farming to get bigger and better, and for that I AM VERY GLAD, its the way it has been from the start. But the ascension item and epic coins drops need to return.

Come on Zephyr do you really believe that stuff?? crap?? (Tim also multiple times talked about wanting to add more features to address F2P/C2P players. (In terms of doing something — they are. They’re working on adding new ways to get both heroes and ascension mats.
Ok here is the way I see these. On the #1 quote> when they make something such as the new raid tournament let everyone choose from a list of players and troops that way everyone is even. That lets weaker players have a shot even though a tiny shot, because we know the more experienced players mos generally play better.
Now to the easiest quote to help them with #2> code it in to raise the drop rates back to before they was this horrible.

Ever thought of buying a book to spend your free time on? :wink:


A cap on availability liken to the am roll for atlantis or specific number available for “epic” deals and such. I like where your head is on this :trophy:

1 Like


If I thought the game designers and developers were constantly lying to me then I wouldn’t play this game.

It sounds like you mean the Raid Tournament loot, which they’ve already said is temporarily reduced while they fix the matchmaking problems.

I believe that too.


No I dont mean the tournament loot. I mean the drop rate of 1 year ago or farther.

I never said they was lying, I just said they could do more for the normal people without the loaded teams and troops but troops more so.

yeah same here. My alliance is falling apart aswell. im done with this game. Small giant surely have to rethink the odds. have a look at hearthstone. guaranteed rare card in every pack. the game is running perfectly and the community is less toxic.

I must say that I have been playing for more than a year and a half and I love the game.
first something I like most is that the same algorithm of the game gives you the real option of being able to grow without spending money in the same way that no matter how much money you spend you will not be the best for this if you do not learn how to play it .
Throughout my experience as a player I have come to the personal conclusion that the algorithm affects each player individually.
although the level of invocations has a percentage X of being able to draw a hero of good level, from my point of view this is tied to the player.
I mean that it is not the same as a level 10 performs an invocation for a level 30 or 50 player.
which I think is great.
also come to the conclusion that there is a balance which is tied to your level, amount of team power and number of heroes you have (high level) which is obvious since the algorithm of the game ensures that harmony is maintained if we met with players of level 10 with heroes of 5 stars at their maximum power because they managed to spend their birthday money and made many invocation. the only thing we would achieve is an imbalance of power which would complicate the whole game and frustrate many players giving the wrong idea which in other rpg they do in which more spend better situation has and that does not happen here as the team does not matter that you have neither to the level that this can always be defeated since no team is invincible.
I have come to the conclusion that one receives a certain number of heroes until they are in harmony or have the balance completely even, which if one removes the balance from one side or another, the algorithm will balance the correct side.
said this I will explain
if we are a level let’s say 20 and we have very good heroes which allows us to advance on the map and defeat the majority of players of the same level in assaults we will be in harmony as we know it and one of the signs in making many invocations and not draw nothing or that it costs us many invocations either in a training way or in the portal and there are always low or repeated heroes at that moment we will be in harmony which would be level of player vs heroes vs team power.
the way that I see of tipping the balance in our favor at this point would be to level up because by moving to the next levels we should increase the power and levels of heroes in this way the algorithm to find the hathry in the balance will not end up giving heroes of better level (this can be through a coin or an invocation) I have seen how the mystical vision gives currency of invocation which give heroes of 5 stars and that to my understanding is the algorithm of the game looking for the balance. It is the theory that I have.

going in clean:
if I perform 100 invocations (portal or training level 13 or 20) I will get 99 heroes of 3 stars and 1 of 4 stars
and to be able to get 5 star heroes I will need to make 10 4 star invocations.
I clarify that these are invented numbers that are not real, so that they can give an idea.
this means that the best way to get heroes is to do many level 20 training in this way we will be getting closer and closer to getting 5 star heroes for each 3 star invocation we have. if you on a streak get 2,3,4 heroes of 5 stars in a row the most likely that what comes next are heroes of 3 stars my advice if anyone sees that I take out several heroes of 5 stars save their gems and made training since It would be a waste to spend the gems after receiving 3 or 4 heroes of 5 stars the game will not give 6 heroes of 5 stars in a week that may come to pass but the odds are very few almost zero the best way to get heroes In my opinion it is to level up.
also keep in mind that a player until he reaches level 30 is not going to be able to use 5 heroes of 5 stars together in his team since the game does not allow it keeping a balance which I think is great is a game of patience guys and in some way they could be the number one in all of the game in less than a month would be completely boring and frustrating and would miss the best that the game offers remember that it is not fun to get to the mint if you do not enjoy the tour
I apologize for my English but I work through a translator
I do not say that this theory is correct but that is how I see the game and so far in almost 2 years I have not seen reasons to think otherwise

ratabboy arg

Cookie Settings