🏅 [Apr 22, 2019] 3rd Raid Tournament! — 5* Bloody Battle, All Elements

General Discussion
1

This Week’s Raid Challenge

THE TOURNAMENT IS UNDERWAY!

The Tournament begins 8:00:00 AM (08:00 GMT).

This thread is for information and discussion on team planning, strategy, and FAQs.

For other threads in the Third Raid Tournament series, please see:

:no_pedestrians: This Week’s Restrictions & Special Rule

:fire: :leaves: :snowflake: :new_moon_with_face: :sun_with_face:
Elements Allowed
 :superhero: :star2:
Hero Rarities Allowed		 :person_fencing: :star2:
Troop Rarities Allowed
:fire: :leaves: :snowflake: :new_moon_with_face: :sun_with_face:
No Restrictions		 :five: :star:
or lower		 :four: :star:
or lower

credit to @TomV93 for the inspiration on element emojis

Special Rule: Bloody Battle – Healing or resurrection have no effect!

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NOTE: There’s a bug with this: [KNOWN ISSUE - Raid Tournaments / Bloody Battle] Atomos and Hero Talents Healing/Reving Enabled

:left_speech_bubble: Share & Discuss Your Teams, Thoughts, and Questions!

Some topics to start off with:

  • Do this week’s restrictions on hero/troop rarity and elements make your bench depth better or worse suited to this Raid Tournament than Regular Raids?

  • Are there heroes you’re likely to use for this Tournament that you normally don’t make use of anymore?

  • Are there heroes you plan to power level for this Tournament, or level before the next time a Tournament like this one rolls around?

  • What are you thinking about using for your Defense Team?

  • Are there heroes you expect to see on Enemy Defenses that you think you’ll have a harder time dealing with than usual because of the restrictions or special rule in this Tournament?

  • Which of your heroes will you be likely to use on your Attack Teams?

  • Will the restrictions or special rule of this Tournament change your usual approach to color stacking or team building?

  • Are there elements of this week’s Tournament that are unclear to you?

Overview of Weekly Raid Tournaments

:medal_sports: Tournament

Click for the Overall Process for the Tournament

:tickets: Attacking

Click for How Attacking Works

Other than restrictions on heroes/troops and Special Rules, the Raids themselves in Weekly Raid Tournaments work the same way as regular Raids.

Each day, you’ll be able to attack up to 5 teams.

The flags used for Raid Tournaments are separate from regular Raid flags.

NOTE: Kills in Raid Tournaments count toward your Wanted: Heroes Raid Chest, so Raid Tournaments also effectively give you extra flags to potentially help fill your chest.

One notable difference to Regular Raids — you can’t reroll.

For the whole of the Tournament, you have 4 “Lives.” Each time you lose a Raid, you lose one life.

The lives do not reset across days of the Tournament. Once you’d lost 4 times at any point during the Tournament, you are out.

If you choose, you can pay some gems to reset your lives after 4 losses — but your score and ranking would still be lowered because of the losses. Paying to reset your lives does NOT give you an advantage from the Raids you’ve already fought. It simply allows you to continue using your normal 5 flags per day and not be “out” of the Tournament.

There is no way to buy additional flags. So everyone ultimately had the same number of maximum flags to use for attacks during the Tournament. The only thing gems allow you to do is continue playing if you’ve used up all of your lives.

@NPNKY explained this well:

CAVEAT: How this worked in beta changed SEVERAL times during testing. It’s very possible we’ll see how all of this works evolve over time, much like Alliance Wars have changed many times since initial release.

:busts_in_silhouette: Matchmaking

Obviously this was an area with a lot of problems the first time around, and improvements but still problems the second time around.

As this hasn’t worked as intended yet, we don’t know exactly what to expect with the new updates.

After the first Raid Tournament, there were updated release notes indicating some changes:

The developers have also set up a Raid Tournament Change Log, but it hasn’t been updated yet with changes for the Third Raid Tournament.

=> 🏅 [Third Raid Tournament] Discussion and Feedback on the Updated Raid Tournament Matchmaking & Difficulty Bonus

Once matchmaking is working correctly, Raid Tournaments should offer some interesting shifts vs. normal Raids, because everyone is playing under the same restrictions — if the week’s Tournament only allows 3* heroes, it’s not like you’re taking your 3* team up against someone’s 4* team.

Players with deeper benches meeting the requirements will obviously benefit, but just having a pile of maxed 5* or the best HOTM won’t do anything for you in a tournament that doesn’t allow 5* heroes.

In the long run, that should make Tournaments interesting — but we’ll need to see if the changes to matchmaking have resolved the problems from the first two Raid Tournaments.

:trophy: Scoring

NOTE: Hat tip to @DracoLovesRi for pointing out that there haven’t seemed to be “extra points” for a victorious attack:

New as of the Second Raid Tournament:

To add some of my own thoughts to that on the Difficulty Bonus

The Difficulty Bonus originally seemed to me to be a little esoteric in beta.

That has seemed to still be true in the live Raid Tournaments, where we’ve seen adjustments to that in the first two Raid Tournaments. It will be interesting to see whether that’s tweaked further for this third Raid Tournament.

:shield: Defense Team Grade

Click for How Defense Team Grade Works

I found this was actually very clear and useful — and I think provides some insights into regular Raid Defense Teams too.

The grades are assigned based on a percentage of wins by your Defense Team:

The Defense Grade is determined based on the win percentage of your Defense Team. At the end of each Battle Day, you receive points based on your grade.

Percent Won Grade Points
60% A 900
50% B 650
40% C 500
30% D 400
0% E 200

My Personal Take on This:

The top grade in this approach was awarded to a Defense Team that won 60% of the time. To me, that’s a good confirmation of what many of us have long accepted: Raids are unfair, but not for the reasons you think - Raids MASTER — that is, they heavily favor the attacker, and even a top-notch Defense Team will lose much of the time.

:no_entry_sign: Restrictions

Each Week can have restrictions on:

  • Hero and troop rarity — e.g. only allowing 3* heroes and 2* troops or below

  • Elements — e.g. no red/fire heroes allowed

:dizzy: Special Rules

Each week has ONE Special Rule in effect.

(At least in beta; it’s possible live Tournaments may sometimes have multiple Special Rules at once. If that ever happens, I would be surprised if we see that before core elements like matchmaking are working properly, so I anticipate a single Special Rule for the foreseeable future.)

The possible Special Rules are:

Whichever Special Rule is in effect for a given Tournament remains in effect for the entirety of that Tournament.

The Special Rule affects both Defense and Offense teams.

Some Clarifications/Expansions

  • Rush Attack makes all hero specials of any speed Very Fast — it doesn’t require Very Fast heroes, it turns all heroes into Very Fast heroes. Heroes that are normally Slow or Average can become quite powerful in this setting.

  • Bloody Battle makes any healing effects do nothing. It doesn’t prohibit healers, it just prevents the healing portion of their special skill from having any effect.

  • Buff Booster adds a stackable 20% attack buff to each hero for each active buff on that hero. Using heroes with special skills that grant buffs or multiple buffs can lead to very high attack boosts. These buffs stack with each other and normal attack buffs.

:gem: Rewards

As of the Second Raid Tournament, loot was temporarily reduced:

Loot will presumably remain reduced for the third Raid Tournament, but we’ll see when Registration opens if that’s still the case.

For discussion/feedback about the reduced loot, please see this thread: Reduced Raid Tournament Loot During Work on Matchmaking [Developer Response in Post 334]


Click for Archive of First Tournament's Loot, before reduction

Acronyms in this table:

  • AM: Ascension Materials
  • EHT: Epic Hero Token
  • ETT: Epic Troop Token

Any of the tiers starting at top 75% have a chance for ascension mats.

Here’s the current breakdown for ascension mats, tokens, and Emblems (for simplicity, I didn’t include the Flasks, Atlantis Coins, Battle Items, and Crafting Materials that are in loot in addition to these):

Tier AM Chance EHT/ETT Chance Emblems Chance
75-100% 0 0 1 Draw: 100% x1
50-75% 1 Draw: 5% 3* 1 Draw: 5% EHT, 15% ETT 1 Draw: 20% x3, 30% x2, 50% x1
25-50% 1 Draw: 18% 3*, 2% 4* 1 Draw: 15% EHT, 25% ETT 1 Draw: 40% x5, 60% x3
10-25% 1 Draw: 22% 3*, 3% 4* 2 Draws: 20% EHT, 40% ETT 1 Draw: 40% x5, 35% x10, 25% x20
5-10% 2 Draws: 45% 3*, 5% 4* 2 Draws: 25% EHT, 45% ETT 1 Draw: 10% x50, 20% x30, 30% x20, 40% x10
1-5% 2 Draws: 95% 3*, 5% 4* 2 Draws: 40% EHT, 60% ETT 1 Draw: 5% x100, 30% x50, 30% x30, 35% x20
Top 1% 2 Draws: 90% 3*, 10% 4* 3 Draws: 50% EHT, 50% ETT 1 Draw: 25% x100, 50% x35, 30% x40

:thinking: Feedback on Raid Tournaments

:bug: Bug Reporting

Please see these threads for existing bug reports before creating a new report:

:link: Related Topics


Click for Older Threads

General

Second Raid Tournament

First Raid Tournament

Older Threads from Before Raid Tournaments Launched

6 Likes
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Which team for defense and why?

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  1. Wilbur isn’t good on defense. With so many who have debuffers, its easy to shift it in the attackers benefit.
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Ok I’ll bite.

I’m thinking that I will go with a mostly fast team and some minions in lieu of healing.
Sonya+ - Buddy - Gravemaker - Magni - Caedmon+

I also pondered Inari but don’t think she will get use of her special in the wing. My other 5* hitters are not ready, apart from Greg and I think caedmon+ has an edge with speed. And they’re basically all support for a fiery burning deathball.

Edit: being that cleanse is pretty important, I might switch to:
zimkitty (3-70) - magni -buddy- grave -caedmon/sonya.

Edit3: no. no buddy tank :sweat_smile:

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No resurection? Counts this also for the Fighter-Class?

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I think it will also count Fighter Revive and not allow that, but I’m not sure we ever managed to explicitly confirm that.

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I’ll probably change this 20 times, but here’s my initial idea for Defense while sleepy:

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And what about Elkanen? Does it mean that any effect which increases HP in any way will not be working?

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Elkanen will very definitely NOT heal himself for damage dealt.

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Would be nice to know for sure if the fighter revive will be working or not.
My team will not be including alby, and who will be in my team will be a very tough study I will need to do later today.

12

This is what you need to know to compete in 5-star Bloody Battle.

  1. Healing is reduced to 0. You are allowed to use any heroes, but any healing effects are zeroed out. It is exactly like the whole battlefield is under Perseus’s healing debuff.

  2. Damage over Time (DoT) becomes much more significant. On a Power point-per-point basis DoT hereos deal more damage in total than direct damage SS. Most players deal with this by healing faster than the DoT can accumulate. That tactic will not work in this tournament.

  3. Minions are the next best thing to healing here. They act as armor and become the only way a hero can take more damage without dying.

  4. Cleansing and immunity to status ailments become more important than before because that is the best way to deal with DoT effects. The Monk’s talent becomes rather desireable here. Like in a tank who can shrug off DoT. And makes minions. And debuffs the enemy’s defense. Ho ho ho.

  5. Speed becomes more important than in ordinary raids. If you are not used to raiding without healers you do not realize how short a time you have before your heroes start dropping like flies. You are unconciously counting on some healer to stretch your team’s lifespan longer to get a slow hitter’s SS to fire or to activate a 2nd or 3rd round of a fast hitter’s SS.

19 Likes
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I don’t think this is accurate. The game text explicitly says “or resurrection,” and I saw this elsewhere:

Also discussed here: Raid Tournament - Understanding the Rules and Requirements - #75 by zephyr1

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@zephyr1 I accidentally posted this to the wrong thread. How can I move this over to the strategy thread for the tournament? I tried deleting but the forum wouldn’t let me repost.

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The description say ressurection have no effect.

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Well that’s new. I’m pretty sure it was allowed in beta.

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@zephyr1

These last few posts need to be moved too…

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Welllll… I have one 5* hero, and that’s Ariel… I’ll participate for ■■■■■ and giggles, and hope for a lucky loot roll in the bottom half of the results :stuck_out_tongue:

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Bonjour,
Aucun soin possible mais pensez vous que Léonidas et elkanen sont concerné? (Ils se soignent seul…) les choses ne sont pas très claire concernent ce soin
Merci pour votre réponse

Hello, No care possible but do you think Leonidas and elkanen are concerned? (They look after themselves …) things are not very clear about this careThank you for your answer

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@madmarv @yelnats_24 All set, I moved everything over, and set the other thread to auto-open when the actual Tournament begins so it doesn’t get more posts about team selection & strategy. :slight_smile:

2 Likes