Things need to change. My take on it and it's suggestions

Correct.
Generally accepted figure is that in gachas the top 10% spenders account for 50% income.
I wouldn’t be surprised if in E&P the 50% cut came from a lower percentage because this games pushes whaling a lot.

Simply put: they have the metrics and the targets, we don’t.
[Not targeting you, just feels convenient to quote your lines]

Now…
Do you realize the problem?
“We should get a prize for all our efforts”
That’s the problem.
This is a game and there should be only one prize: fun.
You should compete if that’s fun for you.
You should pull if that’s fun for you.
You should login if that’s fun for you.

The moment you lose sight of that…
It’s your fault.

OP got second?
Wow, that’s amazing - it really is.
He has that in the books and… that should be it.
He should have had fun playing, savouring the thrill of maybe going first or possibly falling off the podium.
If he had all the fun he wanted in doing so… prizes would be irrelevant, just like it’s not relevant if you win and what you win in anything amateur - at least it should.

Everything, literally every single problem, stems from the fact that many players don’t have fun in the game itself.
And since they have fun in something else…
They buy that something else.
And since players buy that something else…
SG sells that something else.

You want SG to sell fun?
Then buy fun.
Buy QoL, balance and the likes and SG will sell those.

Otherwise you can keep saying it’s SG’s fault but really: demand and offer.
That’s all.

When you open the wallet think twice about what you’re buying.
Because that’s what SG is going to sell.

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This maybe unpopular haha I got a 3* purple athere from alliance quest, my alliance wasnt on the top 1000 and I ended up with the sliver token bracket just short.


I didn’t get it from war either as wasn’t in last war
Trust I got it from the AQ.

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Yes atleast learn this lesson now. Respect all players, this is not the first time I saw your rude comments like this.This is not kindergarten but it’s official E&P forum and forum has some rules, go read it before posting rude comments next time.

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I do agree the game is going at a mental speed… It needs to stop and smell the roses…
But if people are competitive and want that top spot that’s there choice, nobody is forcing you to anything on this game apart from YOURSELF!

■■■■■■■ sick and tired of complaining though, I’m not saying that as mod… I’m saying that as a player… Iv spent time and money in the game sure iv had good pulls or bad 60 atlantis pulls all free ■■■■■■■ know how long it took me to save them got nothing… Not even a dupe wilbur or proteus.

I do what’s best for ME in the game iv never cleared NT I could can’t be bothered stay in a bracket that I know benefits ME with the less effort.
If yah wanna be number 1 then that’s yah choice ain’t mine and probably alot of players too… :musical_note: When the going gets tough the tough gets going :musical_note:

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Ain’t gonna happen me n @Guvnor have spoke to staff about this to make it more player friendly.
Sadly no dice… I’d say by this time next year prob be shorter. Haha :joy: welcome to the forum to.

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I don’t mind the high number of complaints, as long as they’re reasonable or at least not simply a rant. I read some complaints, others I simply ignore.

I think there’s quite a lot of legitimate things to complain about the game atm. I actually feel I could complain more about multiple issues. I still complain, but I complain less overall. :wink:

The thing is, I have changed my attitude towards the game: I just don’t care “too much” anymore.

I do hope @TheFur achieves something with his thoughtful, and constructive OP. I just think SG will continue to do whatever they want to do, like they did with costumes for non-S1 and Limit Breakers.

That written, I kindly suggest/remind players that they can always vote with their wallet. :wink:

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Thank you @Dudeious.Maximus and @Guvnor for trying. At least you tried. :+1:

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I love how this is being floated as fact. Please explain where you got this from? The reliance on whales to support a gacha game is long dead due to the market saturation of such games. There is a reason SG released VIP, the dolar a day shop buy, the multitude of low dollar deals available with each summons portal. Zynga’s last payout to SG was $240mil based on earning. And even the most ridiculous whales I know wouldn’t account for $120mil of that earning per you “generally accepted figure”

And here is where I’m done with this thread and taking another hiatus from the forums. The OP could not possibly have been more courteous with his thoughts, and put forward legitimate solutions. But instead this turns into ridiculous finger pointing BS about “you spend so it’s your fault” and finally complaining about other people complaining by mods! Lmao

Thanks for reminding me why I don’t come here often.

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Yeah there is rosta space is one, comes to my mind… As more hero’s coming out everyother month… There a long list of other Qol improvements that are needed.
People about being no1 takes all this effort etc makes me sick really…

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That is my personal experience that I shared I didn’t say anything about the op or others that spend.
How have I said you spend its your fault… All the pulls I did in AR was free?

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I think the concept (Pareto) is 20% of cause made 80% of effect. In this case 20% spenders account for 80% spending. But spending is not income. This game also generate a lot of income from advertisement. That is why they make Mystic Vision more frequent.

On this topic: having played for more than 3 years, I am tired of this horde of updates and new contents… please slow down SG. Better new contents with more quality than new contents that are just repetitive quantity or rushed.

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This is so true. :joy: Whatever they were trying to accomplish with this pressure, it looks like it worked on those who feel like they have to have it all to stay competitive. At least for now.

For the rest or us? Well, I’m proud to say that today is a month since I’ve said enough. Since I have realized that my monthly spending of 250-300€ is not nearly enough to keep the pace. So I said woooooow! You haven’t really deserved the money I’m currently spending, and you are rude enough to ask for more?!

So instead 250-300 in last 30 days they got… 8€. And I feel much better. I recommend everyone to try this experiment. I haven’t gotten literally anything valuable in the meantime (no 5*, no aethers III, no 4* asc mat…) But you still feel good, you know. :wink:

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I honestly think when it comes to the commercialisation and longevity of this game we all have to take into account some factors that don’t seem intuitive.

Without fundamentally changing the game structure there is in my opinion a fairly fixed amount of time we can have a large, vibrant and competitive user base. This is largely due to the fact that new players will take years to catch up to the point where they can realistically compete with those that have been here long enough to build depth in their rosters / emblems and soon LBs. I believe most whales are by their very nature competitive and it gets harder and more expensive for a new whale to compete (you used to have to buy summons and 4*mats, now you have to buy emblems and soon aethers on top of that). If it is hard for whales to catch up it is even more so for those who spend less.

This coupled with the natural (or the sg accelerated) attrition rate of players leads to a smaller and more stagnant list of elite alliances which can struggle to maintain good numbers due to no fault of their own.

I think sg / zygna know all this and prefer to wring out as much money from this game before it dies even if that means speeding it up.

I work with poker (slot) machines and there are a lot of similarities between that industry and the gatcha model - the most profitable model is to burn out the addicted and find new ones when they finally break free. I think the sg / zygna plan involves a new game to replace this one as the main addict driven cash cow when this one dries up a bit and they are developing many of these to increase their odds of finding the next success.

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My current thoughts with Aethers ( I still call them chevrons) is that they are trying to find a way to distribute them for more active participation of the entire game community. The randomization appears to be a strategic way of manipulating results that somehow reward the lower tier players to catch up. I love Ninja 50 and had a great time with Magic Tower completion with buy in flasks. Who knows how this will turn out. I feel that guaranteed loot should be stated so that the cost of heavy active participation has some sort of quantifiable net cost benefit analysis. I am in agreement with fur and confused by their strategy lately with their introduction and Aether rewards availability.

It’s a disgusting shame to everyone! We are bombarded with new hero’s events etc loot has sucked for a long long time. Now with all new heros events etc, the chance of drawing a good 4★ or anything else besides the normal garbage “dawa ,aife or any feeders” hasn’t changed at all EXCEPT for you get crap draws loss of gems i spent over a thousand gems and pulled all 3★ bs! And every player can vouche and say samething and small giant wont do anything about it except take our money and do nothing except lose players. This CRAP needs to stop and be fixed!! Before everyone decides its not worth playing anymore.

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I couldn’t be bothered to write a proper answer yesterday, but today I’m gonna throw my two cents in (the above still holds though).

In short: I agree with complaints about power creep etc. but fixed prizes for the top would only add insult to injury.

As we all know, in terms of power there is a huge disparity between big spenders and everybody else. And since those spenders enjoy (on average) better rewards from titans/tournaments/events, this disparity slowly grows. Adding fixed rewards on top of the existing ones would greatly accelerate the process. I’m fairly sure this would make a lot of moderate spenders quit - no one is going to pay only to be a punching bag. So no, this is not a viable solution.

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Alliance event and Merciless RNG

20characters

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I’ve worked in the industry.
At the time it was considered a design constraint.
Still, if you don’t trust me - which is totally legit - you may want to check this here

The reason is to maximize income, but, as incredible as it can seem, whales are still essential to gachas.
Which is why, despite the existence of all the things you mention, they are releasing hero after hero: that’s where the big money is.
Or at least has proven to be.

Assuming this game actually has 1.4m playing, 10% of that is 140k.
That’s less than 1k on average per “whale”.
Math is absolutely possible.

You are distorting: the fault is not in spending, but rather in what is being spent on.
On E&P spending is your vote.
What you spend on is who you vote.

Yup, but that’s a different cash flow.
One you don’t really manipulate with what you offer to players but rather what you offer to advertisers.
In terms of revenue they can yield significant money (up to 40% of the total) but they don’t belong in the players/developers dynamics: you don’t go to the stadium and pay the ticket for the sponsors on the shirts.
Ask NBA, they did without them up until 2017.

Ditto.
Not only is the most profitable, but it is the most replicable in the sense of frequency: the shorter it takes to milk your cows, the earlier you can go milk your sheeps (i.e. get to the next game).
Longevity is not that needed, you only need new herds.
And that is what many think Zynga chose as their business model.

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Totally agree with you @TheFur.

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I don’t know what constitutes a whale in in this game (ie $1k/week, $1k/month, etc). I suppose a whale will/does spend until they get what they want.

If I had to put a number on those that “go for it”, I’d say between 10k to 15k. But not all of those are whales, so I’d guess less than 15k whales based on my thinking.

I agree with you.