The New, NEW Raid Tournament Loot

I wouldn’t have leveled any of those 3* heroes or noded them. Only did it on the promise of the original loot

Yes. Relevant portion of the statement bolded for emphasis:

If that’s no longer the case, I would be curious to hear where the “significant portion” of emblems will come from.

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The first tournament loot gave a new life to 3* heroes and made sense to think which heroes to use emblems on. Should I leave some for 3* for example? Should i focus on some AoE Slow as well? Now its pointless to even bother with 3* again. 5 days tournament, 75 gems to reset to get f… 10 emblems at the end as top 1%? Total BS

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Tbh, tourneys have been a dissapointment after another since day one. They are fun to play and have potential despite all the bugs but… I’m not gonna participate in tourneys anymore. Don’t care about extra flags for hero chest, don’t care about new loot either. Most people here said that if this is how the loot it’s gonna be from now on they wont spend any gems on continues. Me neither. Loot is nowhere near what they promised. But to be clear I’m not complaining about loot. Loot doesn’t matter. To me this is about trust.

The only reason I kept playing these tourneys is cuz I trusted what devs said in the AMA. I don’t know why they hyped the tourneys this much tbh. They probably had the best intentions when it all started. It was gonna be a major source of mats and emblems, and 3* heroes were going to be relevant again. None of that is true right now though.

If I didn’t trust in their words I wouldn’t have put ANY emblems on Balthazar+20, Bane+11, Mnesseus+7, Belith+7, Gato Rudolph Namahage, Ulmer, etc… I thought I had a chance at getting into top 1% with my 3*. I actually did get in the top and won some crappy silver summon coins. I kept focusing on my 3* heroes cuz I only have a few 5* and not enough mats for them. It made sense at the time. Spend emblems on 3* to get more for 4* and 5*.

I have almost all 3* heroes, all of them maxed. All of them with at least a node. With all the feeders they ate I could’ve maxed 2 rainbow teams of 4*. With all the emblems I wasted on them I could’ve had a defense of 4* star heroes with many nodes. Not 100% sure but I could’ve gotten better scores in AW and titans, and more ascension mats.

Thanks to tourneys I will actually lose gems on resetting 3* and will lose 5% of those emblems too. I’m 2 months behind my clanmates who didn’t level up their 3*. I think that’s what bothers me more than losing gems or emblems. I wasted valuable time, and I hate wasting time.

I’ll just focus on titans and AW from now on. It’s a better gamble at getting AM’s than hoping tourneys’ loot will be restored one day.

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FWIW, the first set of loot was crazy, the current is meh. Restoration still isn’t great odds on anything, even with the problematic set-up with tiering for scoring.

So if they want you guys to spend 75 gems like crazy, they need to do a little tweaking and offer some guarantees to the top of the tiers, IMO:

.5 percent tier: Guaranteed
1 random HOTM, 2 random 4* mat, 1 random 3* mat

Other random junk and emblems

.51-1.5 percent tier: Guaranteed
1 random 5* (non-HOTM), 1 random 4* mat, 1 random 3* mat

Other junk and emblems

1.51-2.5 percent tier: Guaranteed
1 random 4* hero, 1 random 3* mat

Other junk and emblems

2.51-5 percent is just what 5 percent is now, and then it continues from there.

I think this would help it out…if you’re going with this.

New Challenge events

Originally there were less reflect colors in challenge events and fewer 3* heroes. So it was easier.

But new challenge events have five reflect colors and Devs have mentioned adding more challenge events.

Just 5* Tourneys have 24 different versions ( no rule plus 3 rules times all color plus five eliminated colors) and HotM have been going for years.

Static loot

Challenge events have static loot.

You could place Tourney Top 1% twenty times and still get 35x emblems per week ( old system) or 5x emblems per day due to bad RNG.

Invest in titans

Every time they add something, titans become a better investment.

Add Hunter’s Lodge ( titan parts ) and Tourneys are only effective for fun.

Fun?

And paying to continue sucks the fun right out. Maybe after your defeats, you could keep playing but for 50% points earned. If you paid 100g on the last battle day, your points earned after your defeat would restore to 100%

Marketing

That is just marketing speak.

We have been here before. See ascension items below ( emphasis mine).

To be fair, plans often change.

If we can craft emblems in the Alchemy Lab, then I will believe the Devs about "significant source of emblems ".

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I disagree. If you read that message, they use the words to tier how rich a source of emblems each source will be.

  • Significant Portion
  • Portion
  • Small Portion
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Roadmaps

I would absolutely love to be wrong, and I would love for you be correct.

But it is a NESTED statement:

Even if Alchemy Lab provides 0 emblems, Revamped Challenge Events provide 22%+ ( Arrr, it be Commodore Finley to you ) and original Tourney loot provides an average of 9% and VIP Pass provides approximately 9%. That is still 40%+ with Tourney loot providing an average of 9%.

Small Portion ( this section is why Devs never talk to us ).

Interesting that with the Tourneys original loot, on average, each entrant got 324 emblems per year.

Each VIP Pass is guaranteed 365 emblems.

So on average, each entrant getting 324 emblems per year qualifies Tourneys, with the ORIGINAL loot, as “a small portion”.

Notes

Click for notes

1,872
1,872 Class quests ( 3,744 total )
420
420 Challenge events ( 840 total )
324 ( original loot tourneys )
365 ( VIP Pass )
= 5,273
= 5,273 / 12 = 439 / 50 = 8 nodes on a 5* Hero per month

Hero classes & talents guide

FIN

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I’m less than 100 days in, I have 2 5’s and 10 4’s and was also thinking about being a 3 star or some kind of specialist, as I can’t really place well when 4’s and 5’s are allowed anyway. Instead I’ll work on my best / highest star hero’s and if I have nothing to work on I’ll throw some EXP at the gato’s, namahage’s, Balthazar’s etc.

For 4’s I have Skittleskull, Colen, and Ameonna, they’d obviously be more interesting with very fast special rule but ignored otherwise.

It’s like you said, all the interesting choices and strategy one could have used developing their roster pretty much goes out the window.

As a newish player though it would have been a really interesting route to take knowing a wide variety of 3’s / stacking options or specialized 4’s could have paid off in another area of the game but looking like a missed opportunity.

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It is a nested statement, and it’s pretty cryptic to do things that way.

I’m confident I’m correct that Significant Portion > Portion > Small Portion. I’m not confident that they aren’t going to try to use some other new feature to make up the existing shortfall in the raid tourney loot versus a meaningful definition of “Significant portion.”

I’m not sure that “we pay attention to what you say and expect it to have meaning” is a justification for not communicating. Honestly, it’s a justification for being explicit rather than cryptic.

The top 25% were averaging over 500 emblems a year under the old system. My guess would be they weren’t looking at the pooled mean when they asserted “significant portion.” But perhaps I’m wrong.

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Cause the original loot wasn’t crazy enough… Why not add some guarantee HOTM, and “rare” ascension materials.

Seriously, the only thing the loot needs is slightly more emblems. That’s it. It doesn’t need to give better loot than winning 5 alliance wars and weeks worth of beating 12*. It’s not like it requires any serious effort to play or even place well in. I’ve been top 1% in every tournament without having changed a single thing about what heroes I level or spend emblems on. I’m now leveling some more 3* as insurance, but it’s so easy to do it I would do it even for the current loot. A couple feeders and some food to get more emblems for my 5*s? I’ll take it.

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This response is entirely reasonable and really does call for game designers to speak to their flip-flop on loot levels.

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Creating demand for reset emblems all along… :slight_smile:

Pooled mean

I would love for you to be correct.

However, with 1 million plus tourney entrants, I would hope they are paying attention to the pooled mean.

Rumor from Beta says improving the loot for the Bottom 25% was requested when there was a 100 gem entrance fee. Instead of better Bottom 25%, they removed the entrance fee making it F2P ( excuse my laughter ). This preserved the pooled mean.

If Devs are focused on the pooled mean instead of the Top 25%, that would also explain the method they choose to nerf Tournament loot. Instead of raising the low tiers, they lowered the higher tiers, preserving the pooled mean.

Class quests

The difference between the final stage of Class quests and Tourneys is eventually 100% of active players could possibly complete the final stage of all Class quests and get emblems as long as they keep increasing their roster. Even if 100% of active players can complete all stages of all class quests, only 25% can be in the Top 25% of Tourneys and possible revamped Challenge events.

I would argue that this make the pooled mean more important from a designers perspective. They cannot predict the growth, or shrinkage, of completing the final stage of all class quests, but they can force a tiered prize structure on Tourneys and Challenge events.

Challenge event revamp

If they add new challenge events ( rare quests have seven ) this will still be once a month. So the average player will not see an increase in emblems per year.

If Challenge event revamp ( Arrr me Pirate Family bonus ) adds emblems to the tiered prizes, this will boost the emblems earned through Challenge events. But in my opinion, it would once again focus on the pooled mean.

Weekly Tourney

I am slowly understanding why they resisted the Beta suggestion to have a new Tourney start every 23 hours ( running multiple Tourneys at a time ). The loot pay outs would be 1/7th the original Tourney loot.

This is too bad, as some of the Tourney rules are rumored to be quite fun and some favored players with zero HotM. Mostly due to the pressure of roster space on Elder players and titan rewards being so important in Empires ( especially with Hunter’s Lodge coming out ).

Roadmap

I am also beginning to see that game designers never get to add all the cool features they want, because they are busy spending development cycles on fixing things that worked internally, but shattered into a million pieces when exposed to the actual customers.

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hope it’s not taken too serious and hope i’m not banned…
but here is something that crossed my mind…

Gimme hope Joanna /
Gimme more loot version

Well SG they run a company
They run in Helsinki in Finnland
They make a few of their players happy, oh
but they don’t care about the rest at all

They got a system they call raid tournament
and RNG keeps a us in great subjection
But maybe entreaty can make SG see
How everybody could ascend and proceed

Gimme more loot, SG
More loot, SG
Gimme more loot, SG
and ascension mats
Gimme more loot, SG
More loot SG
Loot and ascension mats

I hear they make all the money from gems
To buy new stuff, any shape of things
While every player here daily fears
The killing of another hero

Sneakin’ across all the players patience borders
Now and again gving only few emblems
They don’t care if the fun and games we play
Is ridiculous to ev’ryone

Gimme more loot, SG
More loot, SG
Gimme more loot, SG
and ascension mats
Gimme more loot, SG
More loot SG
Loot and ascension mats

1 Like

How many of us aren’t taking a full part in the tournaments due to the bad loot?
I only used three attacks the first day to help fill my hero chests.
These tournaments aren’t much use for anything more.
The special rules make it guaranteed that you’ll lose your four lives soon enough due to not being able to stack against tanks but where is the real incentive to buy back in?
I know the tournaments and loot are a work in progress but the lack of communication and transparency from staff is creating a bad feeling in the playing population about the future.

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I just lost 3 fights in a row with 0 points so I definitely wont bother with 75gems reset as I’ll end up with 25% loot at best so 5 emblems max.

" We are continuing to Monitor and develop raid tournaments. We will continue adjusting as we get more data."

They’re you go! Now we don’t need one.

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I think what it really boils down to is…

“I know you guys were having a lot of fun and we introduced more strategy and options into our game, but the bottom line is we weren’t making quite as much on gem continues as we thought we would, so this is how it’s going to be.”

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I agree. They hyped it up like Raid tournaments was going to be something special but as quick as a flash it became a boring piece of unrewarding game junk.

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