[Solved - V33 Update] Reflect buffs can only be bypassed by Ranger Talent, Ninja troops, etc. IF there's another defensive buff casted on top of it

[Cymro]

Didn’t take too long for me to find & test it out today…

2 of 5 Finley’s chain hits pierced that particular time. And note the smart pairing that allowed him to resist the defense-debuffs that were reflected… hats off to them!

[stalk_tracer]

Cobalt definitely needs a fix or clear card! Please clarify whether “reflect” is a defensive buff or not as it doesn’t have anything to do with defense stat.

For the theory that if there is any other defensive buff already active, this might cause Cobalt to bypass regardless to Mits’ reflect, please see the attached screenshot where Rigard gets hit.

I’m just trying to understand Cobalt’s special behaviour to bring up a strategy against him. He is currently a bit unstable.

[DrB]

I believe he is working as anticipated. In your first screenshot he appears to have been charged to +3 when he fired – so 100% chance to bypass all defensive buffs (these are buffs put up on your attack team) and hits all; in your second screenshot he appears to have been charged to +1 when he fired – so x% chance to bypass defensive buffs to the target he hits (Rigard it seems; reflect is a defensive buff from Cobalt’s POV).

[stalk_tracer]

I see that this change was rolled out in V33. Thanks for clarification

[Marie1]

Laughable really, they nerf Vela and now nerf MIT’s but Finley and this beast (Cobalt) is fine.

[AnthonyH1995]

I have no problem with mitsuko reflect for blue hero’s are now has a change to be piersed by pieresed tallent ore even ninja troop and cobalt hapens to he able to pierse for 100% after he fires with be 3x mana bar filled.

[genuineness]

Couple of things.

1. Double blue is still very viable and remains a popular choice - couple of top 10 alliances run double blue, usually Cobalt + Finley or Lepus + Finley.
2. Running mono green is a bit of a gamble because you are likely facing 30 gravemakers at that level, so a sluggish board will see half your team shredded before you even get going.
3. Also prior to the release of Francine, running mono green meant that you are likely not going to be able to bring a cleanser in your setup (I think the only other 5* option is Lady Locke and at that level no one brings 4*s not named c.Rigard). This means that if Vela does go off with her attack debuff, you are often left in a bad position. You could go 4-1 and bring a c.Rigs for example, but then 3 green tiles will not be enough to snipe that blue on defense.
4. Many alliances at top 10 level run double of a colour on defense - whether thats double blue, double red or even double green. The main reason it is correct for the majority of people to run rainbow defense is troops. For the average player, they probably have one set of high level troops (either at 23, maybe at 29/30). Many alliances recruiting at top 10 level will have criterias like having 1 set of 29 + 23 troops which allows you to double up on a colour on defence. FWIW, I ran a triple purple defence during v. Fast wars.
5. Mitsy is only a counter if you are able to find 9 tiles (assuming a lvl 23 troop) before she dies. Between the mana slow of telluria and how fast defences are there are many attacks that just get shredded before she is even able to go off.
6. Finally as you pointed out, doubling of colours is only effective if the majority of the alliance is running the same tactic. If 1-2 people run that strat they are easy prey. When 25+ of the alliance do it, I don’t know of that many people who have 6 Mitsuko’s maxed…

[Vikingblood80]

@EmpiresPuzzles

Fixed an issue where Elemental reflect was non-bypassable by rangers and Cobalt. Titanium shield can also be bypassed now

I get the part about Elemental reflect.

Titanium shield: This means fighting bosses in NT (Ninja tower) they can bypass it, right?

Will Ninja troops be able to bypass Elemental reflect,too? I think the answer will be yes.

@Guvnor

Thx, Viking

[Guvnor]

I expect so, yes.

I believe that the Ninja Troop is using the same coding as the Ranger Talent. Obviously i’m not staff or a dev or anything so I can’t say for sure.

[Vikingblood80]

@Guvnor

I believe that the Ninja Troop is using the same coding as the Ranger Talent.

Exactly my thougths

[DGERic]

Just catching up on this topic now… yeah this “fix” reeks of lazy programming and changes the original intended design/spec of Mits to effectively nerf her. Sad to see SG go that way.

[Aboisso27]

It’s a pretty significant nerf. Finley regularly bypasses at least 3 of Mits reflects now. I wouldn’t have an issue with it, honestly, if the talent %s were not complete BS. But, they are. So now there is no longer a natural counter to one of the most OP heros in the game. As for the Ninja guy, that’s fine, it’s written clear into his card that if he gets charged 3x you’re screwed. I know going in to not count on Mits to reflect.

[Tidyup]

According to semantics, there is really no confusion behind this logic. I don’t know why cobalt is bypassing mitsuko’s reflect from the start. Mitsuko reflects ice special skills. So cobalt shouldn’t even be touching her under a shield in the first place

[Guvnor]

@Tidyup

I don’t know why cobalt is bypassing mitsuko’s reflect from the start. Mitsuko reflects ice special skills.

Previously answered / summarised before:

@Guvnor

When there are OTHER defense buffs up, these can trigger the bypass. When it triggers, it then bypasses everything, including the shields.

However, if it’s just the shields (or shields + an offensive buff), the shields don’t trigger the processing of the “bypass” talent or ability & thus everything is reflect.

@Guvnor

TLDR or TLDU:

Before – Reflect (as a buff) would NOT cause the parsing of the Bypass Ability. BUT if there was a buff which affect the heroes’ defence stat in some way, that WOULD cause the processing of the Bypass Abilty. Then if successful, it would bypass/ pierce EVERYTHING (including the reflect shields).

Future – Reflect now WILL cause the parsing of the Bypass Ability & no longer requires another defense modifying buff to be present.

Or in a Logic Sequence (Simplified)

Note: when I say “cause the parsing” what I mean is the condition/ presense of a buff which will enable the chance of Bypass/ Pierce ability.

[gnikdrazil]

Simply admitting it will take longer to fix, instead we choose to patch it and nerf a hero.

I don’t own Mitsuko. She was a hero I used to avoid like a plague now she is just a worse version of Boril. As Boril at least reflects all colors. Mitsuko can only reflect blue. Attacking her with an off colour is extremely easy now.

At least change Mitsuko’s reflect identical to Boril so she will be more useful hero.

[Zathrus]

Reflect and counterattack are completely different things. Mitsuko or Ursena reflecting all would be seriously broken.

I think the direction they went here was extremely wrong and outright lazy though.

[Zsj]

I do have Mitsuko, and you think she’s now a worse Boril? U MAD? Boril counters all but doesn’t reflect, he gets damaged. Mitsuko reflect works for the whole team and they don’t get hurt by blue specials ( unless bypassed ).

Besides, Borils special can also be bypassed. Stating that Boril is better now is extremely silly.

[Ale83]

Cobalt skills x3 no baypass margaret/inari/c.Kadilen dodge. Is ok or is a bug?

[jinbatsu]

@Zathrus

Reflect and counterattack are completely different things. Mitsuko or Ursena reflecting all would be seriously broken.

I complety agree.
Bypass should be only for defense-up status and counter attack. Not all status, like reflect, dodge, etc.

[Zathrus]

I think it should either be what the card says — defense and counterattack only — or it should be EVERYTHING.

The current situation is ridiculous, since the card is no longer correct.