Small Giant please slow down

I’m with you…

The bulk of my time here has been devoted towards balance.

Which always pits you against someone

I showed a team that can do 9,500 damage in a single turn…! And the very first response was:

He then went on to compare a different team that didn’t do half that damage…before it got fixed! Which was also before he retorted

LB will be tier’d. Just mull that over…

Balance is:

And debating that is a great exercise for turning your face blue


thats stupid, should just sell their account and get some money back
its not too late because there is still a good market for EP accounts selling but i guess it will become harder and harder to find new buyers willing to pay a lot for an account

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If you want to buy, fine - but I think it can also work out great not to.

On one level E&P is “Pay 2 Win” and yet, unless you happen to be in one of the very top alliances, it isn’t so much “Pay 4 Wins”. Matches are made for alliance wars and in regard to which titans to face with consideration of the alliances history of battling other alliances/titans to date. In general you will always beat the same number of titans. Game tactics remain the same.

Sure, if you don’t have some heroes you may face a bit more challenge in certain events. Just remember you can always pick your opponents for raids and cup drop whenever you like. I’m settling for platinum tier with my squad still fielding one 4* and that’s currently fine for me. I typically clear up in 6 clean hits and a couple or three goes in the tournament and race through the chests. It all works out.

If a fellow alliance member buys heroes, great. They aren’t my competition. I still typically get into the A tier for titan loot etc. because I’m a good player. If other alliance members buy stuff then that just means we’ll do better in shared contests like wars where we all win. Happy days.


And of course, the summon rates and Hero Academy retrain rates remain the same, so…

The grind continues. Or the spend, for some


Has anyone compared this hurry-up and crash business model to other games that do have successful longevity? Who knows, this game may survive just as long because there’s enough willing individuals that keep spending money on it.

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Worse odds

It gets increasingly worse for non Classic 5* heroes every month as past 5* HotM are automatically added

It is similar to Tavern of Legends odds getting worse each appearance


Click for notes


Classic 5* heroes & costumes

Non Classic 5* heroes

Looks like I did not do the HA10 retraining math. Probably because it is so depressing

But here are some Tavern examples


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good point… the odds of getting a particular hero get reduced as the pool gets diluted… :frowning:


Oh you wanna talk about the El stuff again and taking potshots on me huh.

I actually made a mistake back then calculating gullin’s damage. Since you’re obsessed with your 9500 damage five El team, let me educate you on how much five pigs can actually do over your five El’s

I showed the damage of 2385 back then, that is just for 1 gullin. 2385x5 gullins would be 11925 damage. And this pig may easily dish this damage at anytime whenever he fires, way more efficient than that Wizard of yours.

Well of course on the day when I was gonna throw this truth bomb, SG decided to nerf gullin in certain aspects. So I let it go, because I was too dejected to hear this news.

You really gonna quote mine 1 small line from my comment, which is completely out of context just to make a point? And I was certainly not the first response to this.

Whatever, this will be my go to quote next time.

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I don’t understand how your
"no big deal" was taken out of context

I can push the 9,500 higher also. That was based off Vela and JF only.

Beside the point, however.

The point remains that some people, like me… see something like:

And view it as harmful.

While others see that and do this:

When it comes to balance…
Get your hip waders out…

I will say though…!

Your go-to quote, @Tidyup
Is pretty cool! :+1: Especially in regards to El conversation!

Someone definitely had the whole world against him there!

merely pointing out one instance of ridiculous damage numbers in the context of one hero doesn’t mean you’re defending the cause of game balance.

separate conversation, but it’s relevant to point out that Gullinbursti wasn’t “fixed” because of the potential for high damage numbers; he was “fixed” because the way his special worked changed/ was bugged in Version 39 in a way the developers didn’t intend, and he was brought back to his original form in Version 41.

merely stating that it’s harmful doesn’t make it so.

as of this writing, the current leaderboard for the tournament has 24/25 of the top ranked players’ defense teams featuring Alfrike tanks. i didn’t write them all down, but i’d guess about half of them have double Alfrike. she’s the undisputed queen of Rush Attack, being the tank of choice for everyone who has her and can tank her for tournaments or Rush Attack wars. it’s not even close.

Elradir is a HotM that i rarely see on defense in any format of the game and who some in this forum view as an average hero at best for offense, even with the potential to pull off ridiculous DOT reflect numbers.

you keep coming back to this idea that you’re defending game balance, yet the target hero (Elradir) isn’t even a factor when it comes to players’ complaints about particular heroes being too powerful. i love my Elradir, but even i can say that he wishes he were as relevant as Alfrike or Mother North in Rush, C. Kadilen, Ludwig, Krampus, Elizabeth, Frigg, Morel, or Prof. Lidenbrock, to name a few. i would actually argue that maintaining Elradir as is maintains game balance by giving a new hero a spot to shine in one particular set up of the game rather than the current power creeping going on with new hero releases.

people will barely be able to enjoy their Fiend summoners for a few months before SG releases direct hard counters to them. i’d say that’s also an argument for SG to slow down the pace of new hero releases, in an attempt to get us back on topic.

Right now, at the rate that SG is releasing heroes, the meta will never solidify. Every 4 weeks a brand new set of 5* will be released, each more powerful than the last. To be honest, all the previews is just completely deflating to me rather than getting me excited. It makes me look at what’s coming, what I currently have, and kills any desire to continue pulling. Imagine pulling a top-tier hero now only to discover in a few weeks/months time that they are now obsolete.


I get the arguments about the increased speed of power creep. However this statement really makes me scratch my head. How does a new super hard to get hero with perhaps stats and/or one apsect of their special or passive that is superior to the hero you just pulled make them obsolete? Your hero’s stats and specials haven’t changed! You can still use them in the same way that you intended - unless perhaps you wanted to use them in defense and the defense meta has shifted slightly.

I use Delilah in every war and she is reliable and helps me to get the wins. Despite the fact that Director Z (?) has come out and gotten a buff that makes her significantly better than Delilah… this has not made Delilah (a 2+ year old hero) obsolete in any way. UNLESS you happen to have both, and have such a deep roster of heroes that you will never use Delilah again… but then you are in such a strong position that you really shouldn’t be complaining.

Can you name any recent (say last 6 months or so) that have been released that have now become obsolete due to newer heroes?

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Ohhh pick me. Pick me… The answer is salmon loki :laughing: :popcorn: :beer:


@Mistress_of_Shadows beat me too it

I think 6 months is a stretch for now…

Costume chamber came out less than 2 years ago, and C.Magni ran the leaderboards until Morel came 1.5 years later, and is still swamping us.

C. Magni isn’t exactly… obsolete. That word is a bit like hot garbage. But if I had Morel with 50+ fully leveled 5*, then yeah, that’s a 100% decrease in relevance time from Joon’s (and other S1) run up to last year.

And this thread is all about…

The Pace!

In another year at this pace. I wonder if 6 months before obsolescence takes hold is not an accurate prediction.

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Ah let me qualify that… a hero that has been made obsolete by other heroes, that wasn’t already obsolete when released …


Yeah sure, now you factor in poison, sand, frost damage. While we’re at it, why not include victor/Lady Locke/Morgan DOT to make a point
You only get 9500 damage because you started with that damage and your entire arguement was about those two heroes from the beginning.

if you’re seeing 9500 damage dealt by a 5 team El, that’s probably a joke match anyways. Don’t take it too seriously, it was meant to be funny.

And if you truly want an El balance, he got a -40% drop in his elemental link boost…happy?

@Homaclese , look at what your love for El has done…you created a monster!

Haha… Elradir for El presidente! It was worth it to see the Elradir topic be revived with hundreds of comments after he wasn’t even HOTM any more… but yes this particular monster may never die.

This game is pure business now. And I recently had the reaction that if it were a business Inwas walking into ignoring it’s customer base so wholly, I would have long since stopped supporting that business with my money. So that’s what I did here :grin:
Seriously, just read the responses to the q&a a few months ago to see there’s only care for making money, not making the game fun and inclusive.

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No hero will ever be obsolete unless one desides it to be, and that was really an overstatement by OP. But I strongly support everything he said before that sentence. Why pulling now if you expect that 6 month from now, there will be a whole new set of crazy powerful heros? Wouldn’t that be a completely irrational decision? :slight_smile:

For the same price/odds you could get something way better than today, assuming they continue with hyper production of legendary heros. :slight_smile:


My Margaret became obsolete when I received Kadilen’s costume :disappointed:

I miss Margaret… but it’s hard to justify bringing her along

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