SGG AMA (3/19) Discussion—Summons & Ascension Items

and it creates a cycle. if you place in the top you get additional 3 and 4 star mats that will give you a better shot at winning the next time. Is it any wonder that after placing in the top 10 a few times you tend to stay in the top 10?

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Titan loot

This was never proven.

Tim actually said they have only added emblem rolls and added rare titan loot. Titan loot roll have otherwise remained the same since added to the game.

War Chest

The war chest - 25 points from wins and losses - was the justification for not increasing the ascension item rolls for winning and losing each war ( it is currently 1 for both wins and losses ).

1* / 2* Raid Tournaments

This is true of Challenge events but not Raid Tournaments.

I will only be competing in the 1* and 2* hero Raid tournaments. 3* / 4* ascension items do not help 1* / 2* heroes, only emblems do.

Several high level players have already said they will not keep a roster of 2x rainbow 1*+15 teams ( total of ten heroes ) and 1x rainbow 2*+15 team ( five more for a total of fifteen heroes ) to compete in this Tourneys so they will be skipping their chance at those rewards.

The rumors I have heard some testers love 1* / 2* Tourneys since only classic heroes can be used.


Tim said during the call that as far as he knows, the drop rates have not been changed for any source of ascension mats.

He made it clear that their intention is to increase the overall availability of ascension mats — not to add one source just to reduce another.

They want there to be more ascension mats available in the game overall.


Correct. The current design of Raid Tournaments (and a new version was just released a few hours ago) is this:

  1. Free to enter
  2. Rules changes weekly. Rules may restrict rarity of heroes and troops used, colors used, and add a special rule like “all heroes have very fast mana” or “no healing”.
  3. You set a defense team that follows these restrictions and considers the special rule, if any.
  4. Each player gets five flags per day, over four days. Unused flags do not carry over. These flags are NOT the same as normal raid flags and cannot be replenished with flasks or any other means
  5. You are randomly assigned a raid opponent to do battle with.
  6. If you win, you get 200 points plus a bounty (about 30 to 150) based on some metric of comparative success
  7. If you lose, you get many fewer points, similar to war. You also get a strike against you. Strikes carry over the entire week.
  8. You keep raiding until either (a) you run out of flags or (b) you have four strikes.
  9. If you accumulate four strikes, you may clear those by paying 75 gems. You do NOT get back those raid flags, though, so your maximum score is (sharply) lowered by those losses even if you pay to continue
  10. At the end of the fourth day, loot is awarded
  11. Loot is in tiers: 100%-75.1%, 75%-50.1%, … 10%-1.1%, top 1%, top player.
  12. Each loot tier has fixed, published odds of getting various prizes. Higher tiers have better odds.
  13. What loot you actually get is random, within those odds.

The people who come out on top will not have paid anything. Of the 20 raids, they will have gotten records of at least 17-3, which is certainly achievable. People who shell out 75 gems are looking to nudge themselves up from, say, the bottom half to the top half. Sure, there’s some better loot there, but the real goodies are for the top 25% and, particularly the top 10% and better. My guess is that needing to continue once locks you out of top 10% (with a maximum win-loss record of 16-4); twice locks you out of top 25% (max win-loss of 12-8).

I think this design is really well done.

  • There’s a large luck component to it, based on boards and opponents.
  • There’s an even larger skill component in knowing how to manipulate the boards thoughtfully (these are not timed events).
  • Having great, legendary heroes will help in some weeks but not others–and the heroes that are great in normal use may not be great under the special rule. (Guardian Owl at Very Fast mana; oh my.)
  • And finally, you can’t buy endless retries to buy your way to the top.

I very much suspect that the rewards for 1 and 2 star tournaments will not be something that will make a big impact on leveling. So while it maybe a more level playing field, what you are playing for may not be worth much. I would be happy to learn that I’m wrong about the rewards.

Every time I ready very fast mana events I keep hoping they don’t allow Alby or MN in…it would be very hard to defeat someone with two of those on a team if they were v. fast mana.

FWIW, all of the “very fast” rule raids I remember also were capped at Epic heroes and Rare troops. It was having a maxed Little John and Colen that gave me the edge in those.


There are two ways they can avoid MN and Alby at least some of the time with rule variations:

  • Disallow Nature heroes

  • Disallow 5* heroes

I personally tend to think that all heroes being Very Fast is a lot more interesting with 3* or 4* heroes than 5* heroes. So I hope that Very Fast 5* Tournaments would be very uncommon or non-existent.

Actually I would like a very fast 5* tournament! Everything difficult is nice, fun and your playing skills will grow :slight_smile:


Huh? Wouldn’t a “very fast” rule preclude using LJ and Colen? In fact, wouldn’t this rule pretty much preclude most players from even participating since few heroes would actually qualify and only players with an extensive stable of HotM’s, Atlantis and Event Heroes would even be able to field a team. Or am I misunderstanding how this rule functions?

Does it instead grant LJ and Colen a very fast speed instead of their normal “glacial”?

very fast rule turns all heroes who enter into a hero with very fast mana - for the duration of that tournament. So yeah, strong AOE hitters that were made slow for balance would rule.

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Unlike Challenge events, there are no fixed rewards.

Rumor in Beta is all rewards are random, but the same for all Tourneys ( 1* to 5* )


10-25% Tier might be ( subject to change):

1 draw / roll for ascension item

4*= 3%,
3*= 22%,
2*= 40%,
1*= 35%

So your rewards for winning a 5* tourney will be the same for winning a 1* tourney.


If I read correctly it’s doing well in the tourneys that will give more ams which really doesn’t fill me with confidence that any other than the usual faces will get any…

Not trying to be negative and i will wait and see but this is how i read it

I really like that this version is way less winner-take-all than the existing challenge events. I just find it frustrating that the loot at #1 and #2-10 is sooooo much better than the next stages…and to get in the top 10 requires you to expend so many resources that it just doesn’t feel worth it.


The brackets are huge, though, unlike Challenge Events.

It’s going to be something like Top 1%, Top 5%, Top 10%, Top 25%, Top 50%, Top 75%, participated.

Way more people will get at least some loot from Raid Tournaments than in the current Challenge Events rewards structure.

I am hoping the entry fee is low and the weighting is such that the items are spread out (maybe 1 extra roll for each ascending tier) else this will look like a cash grab and fuel the forum negativity

The current entry fee in beta is…

drumroll please…



And the reward skew is???

Any of the tiers starting at top 75% have a chance for ascension mats.

IMPORTANTLY: These might change upon release.

…but here’s the current breakdown for ascension mats and tokens (for simplicity, I didn’t include the Flasks, Atlantis Coins, Emblems, Battle Items, and Crafting Materials that are in loot in addition to these):

| Tier | AM Chance | EHT/ETT Chance |
| — | — | — | — |
| 75-100% | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| 50-75% | 1 Draw: 5% 3* | 1 Draw: 5% EHT, 15% ETT |
| 25-50% | 1 Draw: 18% 3*, 2% 4* | 1 Draw: 15% EHT, 25% ETT |
| 10-25% | 1 Draw: 22% 3*, 3% 4* | 2 Draws: 20% EHT, 40% ETT |
| 5-10% | 2 Draws: 45% 3*, 5% 4* | 2 Draws: 25% EHT, 45% ETT |
| 1-5% | 2 Draws: 95% 3*, 5% 4* | 2 Draws: 40% EHT, 60% ETT |
| Top 1% | 2 Draws: 90% 3*, 10% 4* | 3 Draws: 50% EHT, 50% ETT |


Still need to be top 10% to get anything meaningful to those of us that are further along and get 3* mats quicker than food to use them but that is a workable base assuming they are free to enter to keep participation up (increasing the size of each pool) this will likely add enough to make a meaningful difference