RPG Game with strategy elements OR Strategy Game with RPG elements?

General Discussion
1

From the debates about Clarissa/JF etc, to the Beta testers to anti-nerfers thread, to the nerf Telluria thread, there seems to be a huge divide between players on what is good for the game; it seems both sides of the argument thinks that the other side only cares for themselves and not the health of the game.

After reading @Duaneski’s post in the nerf Telluria thread comparing E&P with Magic the Gathering, I had a sudden epiphany for why I think there are such polarizing opinions for this game.

The heart of the problem lies the question: Is this game a RPG game with some strategy elements, or is this a strategy game with some RPG elements?

I remember nearly 20 years ago, when I was barely a small elementary school boy first starting out playing online games, I discovered BattleOn and Runescape. I remember at the time, my mom only allowed me to play on the computer 30 minutes per week. I spent nearly all my time mining, dreaming of the day when I can finally mine rune ore.

I was never concerned with the level cap or balance between short swords and two-handed swords and scimitars, nor did I think rune armor should be nerfed because it is stronger than steel armor. I took it for granted that the higher level you were, the better items you could get; that was what drew me into the game; I can keep playing, slowly building up my skills, slowly saving up enough gold to buy the best weapons and armors or create them myself.

I also happen to enjoy strategy games like Chess and Go. I would never, in a million years, approve of the FIDE (international chess federation) suddenly creating trebuchet pieces that can capture pieces 5 squares away or Emperor pieces that can move like the Queen and knight combined. That would absolutely break game balance and change the game.

But I just don’t view E&P as a cut-throat strategy game where the main purpose is to outsmart your opponent. Heck, the game is essentially entirely PvE; even pvp parts of the game, you’re not playing against another player, but against AI-controlled players. So, essentially, the game is PvE. Adding in all of the luck factor involved, and the fact that 99% of the players don’t really have the bench depth for really detailed strategy…

I just see E&P as a newer, mobile, MMORPG-like game, where the main draw of the game is to slowly build up your base, slowly build up your team, slowly get stronger, get better heroes, a game where the main draw of the game is progress.

Thus, I don’t see any problem with new heroes being stronger than old heroes just as I don’t see any problems with Ursena being stronger than Aife; the game should progress, the game is progress. I also want newer, tougher challenges, an Ultimate challenge event maybe, elite POV, etc etc etc, so players can continue to build, continue to expand, continue to meet greater and great challenges while progressing their character.

But after reading Duaneski’s post, I’m beginning to realize that given the demographics of the forums, many players here are very dedicated (or else they wouldn’t be on the forums) and are past the base-building part of the game; to them, this is a cut-throat, competitive strategy game much like chess or Go or perhaps poker, given the element of luck involved. It’s completely understandable then, that they would value “balance” first and foremost, above all else.

It’s a complete difference in how one understands the game.

I went to the Play Store to check out how SG themselves wanted to call the game.

Apparently, E&P is, to quote:

I would smirk and say there’s not a single word about “strategy” in there, but in all honestly, I think it isn’t really clear whether they’re envisioning this to be a fantasy RPG adventure or a strategy game with fantasy elements.

Yeah, a smarty-pants would say “porque no los dos”; but I guess, the point being, I think this is why there is a divide in the community on how the game should be, and why each side thinks the other is ruining the game; because the two visions of the game are fundamentally incompatible.

So what do you think? Is E&P a strategy game or an RPG game?

  • Mostly a Strategy Game
  • Mostly a RPG Game
  • Bring me the sofa and popcorn!
0 voters
6 Likes
2

I don’t think it’s either really.
But I selected strategy because there is a level of strategy as far as team composition, special skill usage, troop allocation, class/emblem path, costume status and even where and how you match tiles (do you go top down to open new possibilities, create a dragon or just match 3, etc.).

I know a lot of people have stated this, but for me when our alliance leaders looked at my war hit and clarified the actual amount of bad boards I created myself by poor match play it shook my perspective on the skill vs. luck factor of this game (not saying luck isn’t a factor, just that it doesn’t have to be as big a factor as some people say).

1 Like
3

Maybe it’s a casino game with RNG elements or just a puzzle or a great combination of everything being said.

But…

Do we feel better or worse or equally if we categorized it right?

:wink:

5 Likes
4

Interesting read.

I don’t see this as a strategy game. There are some elements of gameplay that allow strategic decisions. But I’d say it’s core, to me, is more embedded in being an RPG / puzzle game.

RPGs and strategy games both deserve balance, though. I don’t think an RPG that has unmitigated power creep can hope to last the 7+ years SG has said they envision this game going for.

My first gaming experience was Warcraft in the early 90s. There’s a soft spot in my heart for RTS and TBS. But I also played the crap outta RPGs - you mag notice the Starman from Earthbound as my avatar here :wink:

They’re both great genres. I love considering gameplay design in games. I’ve made some of my own games (five now. Admittedly none of them made it past testing :stuck_out_tongue: mostly because testing and balancing IS THE WORST!! :stuck_out_tongue: ) . I have some insight into how challenging it is to balance a game.

Which is why it’s all the more frustrating to look at SG / Zynga balance decisions, see them for what they are (money grabs at worst, “redefining the meta” at best).

Either way, the exact classification of the game isn’t relevant to me. SG will continue to release new content, and that content will be balanced against the hero pool that exists. When new heroes come out, existing heroes become comparatively weaker. And I like my existing heroes (most of them :stuck_out_tongue: ) … so that’s frustrating. Plus. I like my 4* and 3* and I feel I’m getting further from being able to use them. That’s sad too.

Lotta thoughts on this. I know they’re pretty scatter shot but realistically I’ve already given plenty of time and thoughts to this topic anyway.

Thanks for the interesting post, at any rate @bobiscool

2 Likes
5

Uhm, where did you find any RPG here? If for you RPG=gaining levels, then you know nothing about RPG.

1 Like
6

I mean… it what way is it not an RPG?

We take control of an empire, presumably as some sort of leader who directs construction and actions of a group of heroes.

We oversee the leveling up of those heroes, requiring specific things to be done to level them up. When they level up they get stronger.

We go on adventures with our heroes, and as we complete those adventures we get loot.

In our RPG we have abilities that we can customize…

I’m confused why you would say it isn’t an RPG?

7

I also feel is a strategy game. No matter what heroes come out and how the meta shifts, the true strategic players will work their rosters to combat as much as than can and face what RNG leaves them to deal with versus other players who blame RNG for everything and swear that no matter what anyone tries to show them no strategy is involved. If anyone can constantly put up regular high scores everywhere no matter what color tank or aid they are having, I would say that those people understand the strategy involved and try to overcome shortfalls they have as things change.

I honestly see nothing at all of an rpg’s other than loot drops seeing random. In 90% of RPGs you can at least plan on attempting to farm necessary items where here there is no way at all to plan ascending heroes and that alone is one if the biggest problems with the game.

1 Like
8

Take any Civilization game. We are overseeing a nation, exploring, making choices where to go and what to research. Or any 3d shooter, you are killing monsters and collecting loot, and even making hero stronger by collecting armor and weapons. But we don’t call these games RPG.
Empires and Puzzles is a strategy game. It is so far away from table-top RPG or classic Baldur’s Gate or Fallout or recent Outer Worlds or the Witcher.

2 Likes
9

Match-3 game with elements of grinding and robbery!

3 Likes
10

It’s a match game with strategy elements and heavy on randomness. You can have a well put together team, and lose because the random gods of randomness denied you any tiles to work with.

11

Theorycrafting and strategizing via observable/controllable/obtainable aspects does not grant it “Strategy Game” title. It might only be one of the ways a person approaches the game.

Including a lot of irrelevantly variable and disconnected character cards/events/etc does not grant it “Roleplaying Game” title either. You need to have the whole thing revolving/evolving around a solid story, and everything has to be related/part of it in some way or another…

2 Likes
12

RPG is a game where you take the role of 1 character…

@bobiscool RPG is role playing game which clearly EP is not… did you mean RNG?

13

It was the match-3 element that first brought the game to my attention. The additional features beyond a typical candy crush / bejeweled type is what made me give it a try.

It is the team building and varying game elements from wars to raids to events to seasonal maps that have kept me playing this long.

I really don’t even much notice the RNG aspect as I don’t make large amounts of summons and I work the boards to get the wins. Except when the boards refuse to be worked. Then I notice (and I think my neighbours do as well).

Edit: wow, this whole thread I read RPG as RNG :rofl:

1 Like
14

Well… I found E&P because I was looking for a puzzle game. :laughing:

15

I mean… no. Lol. Earthbound and final fantasy both see you take control of parties of characters… or as one might put it… a group of heroes.

Destiny IS a RPG. Many FPS now have RPG elements. Or are outright RPGs.

RPGs ain’t just your old school Chrono Trigger any more boys. Welcome to the 21st :rofl:

2 Likes
16

People who had played rol games now that the distance between rol games and this is infinite squared.

Please … be serious.

P.d. a D&D board game player.

2 Likes
17

I play D&D as well… in fact just started a new scenario with my friends via FaceTime this past Sunday.

RPG elements have been added to a lot of other genres… and as RPGers that’s something we should be proud of :wink:

18

It’ a mix. Made to earn money. But it’s nice and interesting and fun to play. It is not a strategy nor rpg nor fps. And it doesn’t matter. Enjoy it the way it is.

19

Wait telluria been nerfed ?

1 Like
20

She was nerfed in beta. She hasn’t been changed since she was released to the general public :slight_smile: