Resume of how Titan loot works – Tiers, Scores, theories

Yes you do. Not necessarily millions, the amount depends on the amount for possible variation.

You messing up things completely, a pool of opinion and consume is a complete different matter. How you calculate it is completely different. It’s not a matter of random results, it doesn’t follow mathematical equations.

In studies like that the company will study the population and that subject and then select places and a number of people that will represent the general response in the whole country. That is then extrapolated. But it’s not an ACTUAL data, it’s predictions, it can be completely wrong (hello, election of 2017?) if the people interviewed doesn’t represent the country’s variety and different opinions.

This has nothing to do with that, you are completely wrong. Here we talking about one equation, actually computer code, that will randomly generate a result. We do not know the parameters of that code and at what rates each item is set to have. In order to figure this out, you need to select data from each tier in huge amounts.

Again, the dice example, 1-100 face dice, how many tries do need to figure out how much faces my dice has if I didn’t know it? Saying just a few will do is not true. 50 tries won’t be able to tell you that, even if you get the 100, you can’t be sure that’s the highest. For that you need a lot of repetition and thousands of tries to have a lower error and be able to confirm it probably really has only 100 faces.

We have no ideia how much is the odds of the rare and epic stuff. It it’s something like 0,5%, that’s 1-200; 0,1% it’s 1-1000! Few tries might actually not show a single of that rolls or actually show a lot of them.

There’s mathematical equations to calculate error, the more results you have, less error, and so a better understand of the ACTUAL odds. A lot less results have such a huge error that the data is completely useless.

Also wrong for the hundred time… please, read, you cannot make a single data from different loot tier with different odds. I’m not even talking about scores, I’m talking about TIERS. If you wanna now the odds for every tier, it’s one study for each tier. If you just calculate all together, your data will mean nothing other than a average for tiers and won’t answer the questions if one drops more than the other.

Other than that, I’m done trying to explain this subject. This is NOT a thread about odds to begin with. So if you guys wanna do some average or whatever, you can go ahead and start a thread about that and do whatever you want.

I’m not doing that, I have no intention to check odds or prove and disprove “wild claims”, most of each were already answered by the developers themselves. If the person don’t believe what should be a fact, any incomplete data will not be prove for them either. Someone will just point out the obvious, your study has a huge error margin, means nothing, and continuous to claim wild stuff. So nope, I’m out.

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This. Is. Awesome.

-Av

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There are 13 loot tiers, and you need thousands of samples per tier to get good statistics. This posting of screenshots and counting them will never give enough data for you to get any accurate results.

Your 1500 samples would be a bit more than 100 samples per tier. If the chance for 4* item would be same as loot tier, 1% for every tier, the difference between tiers is really small. 100 samples is not enough to give a result even close to reality.

If the math explanation doesn’t work, here is a demo.

Just for fun I did a program that does certain amount of rolls. With the probability same as the tier.

So tier 1 has 1% chance and 13 has 13% chance for loot. This is probably not the right odds in game, but just as an example. Here is the result of 10, 100, 1000, 10000 and 100000 rolls. That is number of rolls per tier and how many % of rolls “gave loot”

As you can see 10 samples is useless. The numbers are hugely wrong. There isn’t even a pattern of growing odds per tier. This is what you see in a single titan kill too. Pure randomness.

100 samples is not nearly enough to get good data either. If you would use this data as basis you would say tier 12 has the best loot, not tier 13 and that tier 6 gets same loot as 13. And loot doesn’t drop at all at tier 1. Just for demonstration I run this 100 samples again, as you can see the results were totally different. But you start to see a pattern of growing odds at this amount of samples.

Even at 1000 samples the order isn’t right, tier 2 getting better loot than tier 3 and biggest error is 1.5%, but we are getting closer. The pattern of growing odds is very clear here.

At 10000 samples the order is already right, but the probability can be off as much as 0,7%, like on tier 9. but I would call this decent results already.

At 100000 samples we got it pretty right.

So as you can see, you need a lot more data you can ever collect here.

And if people stay by the claim that B gets better loot than A+ then you would need to take thousands of samples of A+ results on every titan and compare to thousands of B loots. You will never get that amount of data.

The explanation “But it happens for us constantly” is totally right. The B players get more loot. Not because the odds are better, but because there are more players in the lower tiers. For every A+ roll there are 15 B rolls. The odds are very good that one of them gets loot, but very small that the only A+ player gets any.

Here are the results:

10 samples

1: 0%
2: 0%
3: 0%
4: 10%
5: 0%
6: 0%
7: 20%
8: 10%
9: 0%
10: 0%
11: 20%
12: 0%
13: 0%

100 samples

11: 0%
2: 4%
3: 4%
4: 4%
5: 5%
6: 10%
7: 9%
8: 5%
9: 8%
10: 8%
11: 8%
12: 14%
13: 10%

100 samples second run
1: 0%
2: 2%
3: 2%
4: 3%
5: 3%
6: 9%
7: 6%
8: 9%
9: 9%
10: 11%
11: 9%
12: 10%
13: 19%

1000 samples

1: 0,8%
2: 2,3%
3: 2,2%
4: 4,6%
5: 4,9%
6: 6,8%
7: 5,7%
8: 7,7%
9: 10,5%
10: 11,1%
11: 11,1%
12: 12,2%
13: 14%

10000 samples

1: 0,92%
2: 2,13%
3: 2,96%
4: 4,08%
5: 4,91%
6: 6,07%
7: 6,85%
8: 7,82%
9: 8,3%
10: 10,07%
11: 10,69%
12: 12,04%
13: 13,25%

100000 samples
1: 0,97%
2: 2,04%
3: 3,02%
4: 3,95%
5: 4,99%
6: 6,08%
7: 7,02%
8: 8,1%
9: 8,97%
10: 9,96%
11: 10,92%
12: 11,97%
13: 13,01%

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First off, this is not my first language, I’ve said that before. If there’s anything going on, it’s my frustration, no matter how many times I say the same thing (Arien and Traevon included) I just can’t make people understand the basic and I see myself having to repeat and make examples over and over. There’s no argument to win, it’s basic math, there’s no alternative math.

I’m already ignoring those threads because I’m burn out. But I can’t ignore my own. So please, this is not a thread about that subject, you welcome to do what ever you want and start threads about that, I wish you all luck. But I f you would please stay on topic on this one, it would be greatly appreciated.

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I realized after I made my post @Mai that it was in poor taste and I withdrew it prior to seeing your response.

I apologize profusely, and it will be my last post on the subject.

I’ll start posting my loot again. I stopped taking the screenshots but I can start. I’ll probably just type up the loot rather than post a pic. That’s easier for me, however I guarantee that I can produce a screenshot for any loot posted if needed for verification.

However, I have a new theory that I haven’t seen anyone in this thread mention yet.

The loot may seem worse to you than it actually is just because of the sheer number of items available. This past week I’ve gotten Warm Capes, Trap Tools, Scabbards and many trainer heros. These are all items that players say they want, but for me, they’re worthless. I want orbs of magic and mysterious tonics, items I’ve never seen drop anywhere except in a few screenshots above.

It’s not that we’re not getting ascension items. We’re not getting the specific ones we want.

<Watches as everyone runs over to the “trade everything!!!” thread…>

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FHere are all the reported Titan loots from our alliance today. You’ll see that we were pleasantly surprised to get rare ascension loot for A/A+ (yay, at last! A new colored dog! :laughing: )





Please note, I only get the screenshot showing rare ascension loot (which is what my players care about). If you are not collecting this data, let me know and I’ll stop posting. Thanks!

Rook, very helpful, please continue and thanks for your time and effort. Azure

@Mai. You assume no bias in the delivery algorithm. Bias for profit $$$$$ is not a rare occursnce. And your Holier than Thou attitude and name calling should get you blocked.

I have no problem with Bias, what I assume is that they are not lying. And I described the action of doubting what the developers affirmed was the true based on shallow evidence an engagement in cospiracy and paranoia. That’s not name calling, I’m aware Americans have a higher sensibility about words and all that, but in all my dictionaries none tells me they have a derogatory meaning. So I can only assume it might be a subjective matter and personal feeling about any of those words that I do not share. In that case, I think I said before that I meant to describe the actions and posture taken and not describe a person that hosnestly I know nothing about.

About the “moral superiority” (new expression successfully acquired), I had similar feedback a few times in random conditions, it was told I usually sound somewhat too formal and affirmative, making my opinions don’t sound like what they are. That’s honestly something I struggle with, and I do apologize if somehow I sound like I have all the knowledge in the world and you are all lesser beings. And as always will try to get better with this hellish language.

Not proud of losing my ■■■■ in this post due to frustration, etc, but other than my rudeness I see no line crossed. If you disagree, you can easily open a complain so third parties can check and apply possible punishment, banning me included.

If not this discussion is quite old, at least feels like. I might consider just deleting it all since it doesn’t help the discussing and it’s actually offtopic. But won’t hide it if you intent to file a complaint. The moderators are Avicious and Coppersky.

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As an educated American I applaud your mastery of my language. I also apologize for my thin skinned fellow citizens.

Please continue sharing this type of information it is helpful.

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Attitude isn’t a blockable offense. I believe those are “harassment, spamming and swearing”; Mai is not guilty of any of those. :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

Mai, are you continuing to collect data? I’ve seen enough “other colored dogs” to accept that it’s random–albeit it doesn’t LOOK random.

And yes, name-calling in America is usually the precursor to a fight, though it doesn’t have to be. I prefer leaving the insults at the door. I’d appreciate it if we can keep things on a professional level. :slightly_smiling_face:

I just came back form my trip and kinda overwhelmed, I’ll update it shortly.

I was also told there’s a D “again”, I’m not sure what happened. If I missed it due to bad data or if it was reimplemented. Or a bug?

Next time we skip a Titan I’ll do the least damage and see what’s the D.

Anyone got info about that?

Also, I’ve being trying to figure out what’s the “rule” for when it escapes.

I noticed that a 9* escaping gave A a V loot, same for 8* (although it was suppose to be A+, it showed as A). And a 7* gave C a I loot. Also no such a thing as an A+ for a escaped one it seems.

Anyone has prints from escaped Titans? :slight_smile:

So maybe it’s
T#* -6 + grade?
Like T8* - 6 + 3(A+)= V
T9* - 6 + 2 (A) = V
T7* - 6 + 0 (C) = I

Test it out if you got a escaped one.

Another option, D is only for escaped one?
More research is needed.

I’ll be on the lookout for D’s. No D’s reported in Loot this morning, so I can neither confirm nor deny.

Welcome back!

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I think there is something with how much damage was done. If you do over 50% damage to the titan you get more score and better loot than otherwise. I don’t know exact formula. I got A on last 9* and it escaped with <50% hp and I got tier V. But I think I got more than tier V at some point from escaped one. Don’t remember what level titan it was or my score or the %. Need to keep looking.

Posting these loot pics is quite useless. You will never get enough data to make any real statistics, like I showed you in an earlier post.

And if the point was to create statistics, you would need to post every loot. Not just the rare ones or the bad ones.

I’ve said plenty of time here, not doing statistics, just filling my list with possible loot patterns. And trying to figure out titans, he.

If it takes HP into consideration, it can’t be other than 50%. But that’s a good point. Got no D reported on a defeated Titan, I’m pretty sure it’s only on escaped ones at this point.

If it’s any help I would like to send some of my results to help your cause. If I get annoying, by all means, please let me know!

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I’m pretty much 100% confident it is just on escaped titans.

Escape loot tiers escape me at the moment, but I’ve been in loot tier V and loot tier 1 off 8/9* dependent on I believe individual performance, the D was a 1 and I was something like 27/30 at the time. I saw it again on my alt at one point likewise early, but haven’t really tried to track it closely.

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Actually I found it again: busy at work makes for an awkward alt titan performance heh.

6* Titan - Escape
Damage 7875, 25th on scoreboard
D rating, Loot Tier 1

I will try to track escapes and resultant loot tier maybe that can be figured out too as far as tiering goes.

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