Raids are unfair, but not for the reasons you think - Raids MASTER

I wrote that, maybe not that clearly :rofl:

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Aaaah yes. If I may be a grammar pedant Python…

You wrote “…match 3 (before click any diamond and any dragon)”

Perhaps it should be:

“…match 3 (before, click any diamond and any dragon)”

That comma makes all the difference, to me, in putting the instructions in order :joy:

Sorry…off topic…so raids are fun and @NPNKY continues to be wise and amazing :+1:

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All if those reasons only work if you get a decent board to work from. I have found on almost every occasion the board is rigged towards the AI winning!

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The boards are random. Its been demonstrated over and over on here. Do bad boards happen? Sure they do. So do awesome boards. We just tend to notice and remember the bad more than the good. Its called confirmation bias.

If you don’t believe me, take a screenshot of the starting board for your next 600 raids. Do 100 with a rainbow team and 100 with a double color team in each color. Every raid, not just the bad or the good. For each board, note down the number of tiles of each color and whether it was a rainbow team or a stacked team. Then figure out the averages for number of tiles of each color overall and broken down by stacked colors. You will find (just like everyone else who has already done this) that the average is 7 tiles of each color regardless of whether you stack or not.

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It is not that the post is irrelevant to its title, therefore misleading at least, it is that everyone agrees that it is good! Do you even try to think before you write anything? Let me ask you all something… The title is about fairness of raids, right? And you claim that because the attacker has some advantages over the defender (AI) it is fair to fight a team with 300, 500 or 800 more power, right? (not to mention fighting one with 5* heroes vs your 3*). And this happens because you have about the same trophies. Btw, choosing not to fight is NOT an advantage. Anyway, I fight a team 500 stronger than mine and it is fair, so according to you the raid system is fair. What happens when the other guy (or anyone like him) fights my team? Same trophies, 500 stronger and all the afore mentioned advantages… Still fair? But i guess you did NOT think about that (He might also get more trophies LOL!).
Let me ask you something else. Do you think those who complain lack the fighting skills? Let me inform you that only a skilled player find himself in the unfair position of having to fight a much more powerfull team, because he/she was skilled enough to get the same trophies with a weaker team, in the 1st place. But I am sure you didn’t think of that as well.
And a last thing. When discussing about fairness of choice (raid system in this case), it only makes sense when you compare it to another alternative, cause no raids at all is a free choice for anyone to make. It is like arguing whether someone is taller or shorter. From whom? In this case the undeniable fairer alternative is team power. Both players (attacker and avenger) have the same tools to use, equal teams… and may the best player win. But as I wrote before, you did NOT think of the other player(s). Change the title of this thread to “Raiding Guide” or something similar. I guess you CAN do that.
Oh…and a last thing. Team power does not make money, as trophies do. And I would expect a Dev, to come forth and admit it: “It is unfair, but it makes money”. It would save us a lot of annoying posts. Why? Can’t think about that too? Ok, here it is: If I am good, I win trophies, I have to fight stronger opponents, or find less stronger. For the later, I need food which eventually I will need to buy. If I keep winning stronger opponents, I usually win many trophies, which make thing worse. I need to start losing, but then I spend my flags. If I need the rewards, I have to buy energy flasks, or tokens to upgrade my team. The point is, I can’t keep winning without spending. On the other hand, a less skillful, but spending player, has to fight better opponents, but with weaker teams. Those who pay, get rewarded. So that they will pay more.

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I will take my team of maxed 3* heroes up against your team of unleveled 5* heroes any day of the week. Team power will be within 50-100 points. I will wipe the floor with you 8 times out of 10. Why? Because hero power is not as important as team synergy. I will choose my heroes to counter yours. I will stack colors. I will ghost tiles. And I will win, even if you spent a fortune to get those unleveled 5*

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You must be joking right? 1st of all you haven’t understood anything I wrote. 2nd I must spend about 100k food each time I want to find a team within 50 to 100 points. I get 300 to 700 points opponents with maxed 4s* and 5s*. I only have one 4* at 50lvl. Still this is not the point. The point is that if I manage to win the 300 points stronger team, he/she will wipe the floor with me easily (since you like the expression) and even get more trophies. Fair means equilibrium. I can win 6-7 out of 10 times (I don’t argue with that), but I am beaten 8-9 out of 10, because I have too many trophies for my team’s power, and I am put against teams with similar amount of trophie, not power. Think about that.

That’s how it works. Because of the attacker’s advantages, most players gain trophies when they attack and then lose them on defense. I regularly climb into diamond, generally beating teams 300+ points higher than mine, to open my chest, but more often than not, I drop back to high platinum overnight.

And apparently you don’t understand how the trophies work. If you attack someone with the same trophy count as you, you will win or lose 30 trophies. If they have more trophies than you, you will gain more than 30 for a win or lose less than 30 for a loss. If they have fewer than you, you will gain less than 30 for a win and lose more than 30 for a loss. The system is designed to reward you for aiming higher

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It seems like you have the same problem I’ve had for a long time: your offensive raid team(s) seem to be significantly better than your defensive raid team, so you can push your trophy count higher than your defense can maintain. I’ve made my peace with it (plus I have Vivica and Richard in the pipeline to help me with this issue soon). If it bugs you, though, it might be worth focusing on more defensive heroes for a bit.

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And how is it apparent that I don’t understand trophies? When did I write or imply anything different? Pls enlighten me.

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The question is not whether I have a problem with that or not. The question is whether it is fair or not, when you have to fight teams of significantly more powerful opponents, which in turn can attack you, in order to advance in the trophy Tier. And the answer is that it is not fair, but it makes money.

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Let me ask you something else. Have you ever seen a 3-star Heroes team fighting in the platinum tier? I guess not. You need four or five star Heroes to do that. And if you don’t want to wait until you get a level 20 workshop, you have to pay. If a player had to fight players of equal strength and get rewarded for it then you would seem 3-star teams or less, entering the diamond tier.

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Get my level 20 Training Camp next week. I have paid $0.

I fight comfortably in Platinum with my levelled 4* team of around 3200 power.

Still paid $0.

Your team will have a natural trophy level that you will return to. Mine is currently 1900.

If I fight well and choose beatable opponents (normally 3400 or less) I can get to 2100. If I lose a few I will drop to 1800.

I don’t see why people get so upset about this dynamic?

Do you expect to only fight teams of identical strength?

As you said, the more you win, the stronger opponents you face. And then you lose a few, drop back and try again. As you get new heroes and improve them, your natural position will improve.

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Who said anything about being upset? Jesus Christ you guys. I said it’s not fair compared to a power system. That’s all. But Thanks for confirming me. You DO have a 4 Star Heroes team in order to achieve platinum tier. You DO have to get better Heroes and improve them, for which you need to wait a lot (and be lucky) or PAY. You would not have to pay in a power system in order to achieve higher tiers.

If I’m understanding you correctly, you want to be able to continuously raid other 3* teams with your 3* team and amass enough trophies to get to platinum/diamond tier without ever having to improve your team. What you’re suggesting would change trophies from a decent ranking system into basically another experience mechanic and remove the competitive aspect of raiding, which is what a lot of people (myself included) enjoy about it.

Plus, I wouldn’t even call such a system fair compared to the current system. Team power is not an accurate indication of the effectiveness of that team. For example, a team of 5 Dawas will always get steamrolled by a balanced 3* rainbow team despite the two teams having the same team power and thus being matched together under a power-based system. Without any way to account for team effectiveness and player skill, raid matchmaking would be more unbalanced, not less.

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@ZisisK It sounds to me like you want to have it both ways. You want to be able to win enough trophies to get into platinum or diamond tier, but you only want to be matched up against 3* heroes. Life doesn’t work that way, kitten. In gold tier, you will find mostly 3* and a few 4* heroes, because that is the trophy level those heroes can sustain. In platinum, you’ll find mostly maxed 4* with a scattering of 5*. Again, that’s what those heroes can sustain. In diamond, you’ll find mostly maxed 5* with a few of the better 4*. That’s what it takes to sustain diamond tier. There are no shortcuts to get there, either. Even if you spend money to summon lots of 5* heroes, you still have to grind the map to level them up, you still need to accumulate the ascension items to get them maxed, and most importantly, you need to learn how to use them and how to play the board.

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  1. If I am a better player, yes I would like to win all the time. You call this unfair.

  2. If this rainbow setup you describe happened with the rainbow team being 300 points stronger, due to trophies comparison, would it be fair then? What a great argument… You can’t refer to a situation that could apply to both options, in order to support one of them. JC!

  3. The power is not accurate, but trophies are? Whatever argument you may come up with, power is still fairer. Period. You want to compete a kindergarten kid in maths, because he has won all the other kids and call it fair? Bad for you.

  4. For whatever good, a power system can be calibrated to adjust for any advantage of the attacker. Trophies system cannot.

  5. Before spending time to waste mine, my next (and unsent) answer will be “WHATEVER”.

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In that case, have fun with your raiding and have a nice day! :slightly_smiling_face:

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I may just make this my new saying…thanks for the laugh! :joy:

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This may or may not help. I’m in platinum, I have never seen diamond. This is my current defense lineup:

This is my offense, what I attack with:

Notice that while they have some of the same heroes, and similar team power, they are not the same in team composition and function differently.

Sometimes I switch out WuKong for Melendor when I want a high green tile damage against blue; I would never attack a blue with Kashrek (team 1) who is clearly Defense.

I dunno about all this “pay” business; my Magni came from a free epic hero token and my currently unleveled Thorne was a free roll from a TC20. (Thirteen of my 4* came from TC20, with an additional three from my TC13).

Do people pay for higher cards? Sure. Does that make them better than me? shrug My ego doesn’t rise and fall on being beaten in a game. Is it FAIR? If the same standard is applied to everyone, then yes, it is fair.

EDIT: I try to only attack for 40+ cups or more. This increases my gains and reduces my losses. My Watchtower shows the last 20 fights as 14 losses and 6 wins…mostly defense…roughly 100 points up and down, back and forth. :wink:

That may not be what you’re looking for, but I hope it helps.

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