Passing on the epic offer, I think

This is empires and Puzzles

There is no skill involved and there will never be, especially in events

This coming from a guy that spent more on the game than some people on cars

When have you ever seen a F2P player with TC20 heroes come anywhere close in top 10 in events

Hah ā€“ this assertion is so demonstrably false. The elite winners of the challenge events, players like @Dator, @Wharflord and @Xero786 are far better than the average player at quickly reading the tiles, seeing combos, etc. Watch their videos and see if you see all the moves, as quickly as they do. I sure donā€™t.

Great heroes, great troops, and lots of items only goes so far. You can get top 10 with those. Winning? That takes great skill and focus.

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And where does having good board knowledge get you without high level troops, top heroes, battle items and flasks? No where

And sure their board knowledge is better than the AVERAGE player. Iā€™ve watched their videos and I also watched videos from line groups with players who have just as good board knowledge but donā€™t spend someoneā€™s monthly salary on a game

So yes decent board knowledge + best troops and heroes etc will win you events, itā€™s just funny when those players say they F2P players can complete

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Itā€™s easy to assemble the heroes, troops and items needed to compete in Rare. Yet the same folks keep winning it. Thatā€™s skill, not items.

So at least we agree on this: there is a skill component. Skill must be combined with preparedness and, for the legendary levels, thereā€™s a benefit to spending.

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I donā€™t agree with the fact that no skills are impliedā€¦it is not trueā€¦If you see videos of top players pushing on events and scoring top 3 or better, you will realize that the heroes involved are all available in TC20. So it is not a matter of having a particular hotm or not. As @Kerridoc said, quickly reading the tiles, seeing combos and understanding when you can go for a good score or not requires skills.

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Actually, the only benefit in spending for events can come from the possibilities to have more flagsā€¦item can be crafted and you have to be focused and prepare for the events if you want to go in top 10. I donā€™t think that all people competing in events and scoring top 10 have lv 30 troops.

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Sour grapes doesnā€™t become you, @Denys. Even if you gave the average player the same fully maxed heroes, unlimited battle items, and unlimited flasks, the top players would still win, because they understand team synergy, timing of specials and items, and playing the board far better than everyone else. Thatā€™s skill.

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I dont have level 30 troops either! My highest is a lvl 23 mana troop and second highest is like a lvl 12 crit. I think crit troops are more important on events than mana troops because of the damage. You want that tile damage. But am I going to lvl up my crit troops because of the event? No, Iā€™m doing just fine. Troops are not everything.

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To add to this. I gave UCLA a run for her money in Epic with all level 1 troops. And my ā€œspecialā€ heroes there were Triton, Jackal and Gretelā€¦ heroes that no one would call elite.

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lol this is still going?

it takes money + skill to rank in epic and legendary events

not one without the other

now if someone thatā€™s f2p would give it a shot to disprove that i would change my tune

how did this turn into bashing players that rank in events?

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I agree with quite alot both sides have said. But, items, especially flasks, can be a deciding factor as one player keeps coming back at another as in the epic @zero vs @Uclapack you mention.

A special challenge simply makes everyone equal in every way but the heroes. This is a variation on old send your best man to decide a war. It is oversimplified, but it would make some players happy to see what can be taken as a bone thrown to free/cheap to play.

Why not embrace it? Yes, boards will play a part, but this is rng.

but equal doesnā€™t mean what you think it does here (ie more skill based and ā€œfairā€. ). Because of the huge variable nature of the boards, and requiring a good board plus skill to get good scores, and good boards being uncommon, then adding MORE retries smooths out the luck factor. limiting to only a few retries per stage would just make it ā€œwho got lucky with more good boardsā€.

The real issue is that in order to smooth out the luck factor every month, you need to purchase energy refills OR only compete every X months.

Those are two separate things.

If we wanted to create an event that was more skill less RNG, there would be a challenge where everyone got 30-50 refills just to use for that sub event.

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As Dante mentioned, the theory that limiting tries in event will somehow make things ā€œfairā€ or ā€œevenā€ is fundamentally flawed. If we want equality in events then remove WE requirements from event stages. And have something like everyone has 30 tries per stage, best score is kept

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Heroes and troops help, of course. However it is possible for FTP players to place top 10 in some of these events, especially in rare. They may have to save up flasks and mats for 2-3 months in order to compete but it can be done.

In the Knights event in April 2018, my teammate Echo (Ellilea on the forums) placed 8th in epic, and Haylc (who is FTP I believe) placed second. Echo was FTP until she quit the game, she was the one of the unluckiest people on TC20 and in summons that I have seen. She didnā€™t have any event heroes including Jackal and Falcon, and those helped a lot in that event. I had better troops, better heroes, and at least as many tries and I placed 15th. That doesnā€™t seem much different, but the winning score of that was 631K, Echo had 618K, and I had 601K. I could have had tons more tries but I would not have beaten the top 10 scores. Since then, I think people are using more mono teams so the scores may be higher but the relative results would have been the same.

Several months ago Zero won all three events and had level 1 troops in epic and rare. There is no way I could have gotten any of those scores in a year of doing those levels. I donā€™t think I am a bad player, but I donā€™t have elite skills. The advantages of flasks, troops, and heroes donā€™t quite push me over.

Iā€™m found a screen shot. Andrei is there and Echo is too. Here is a quote from the closing thread here: Time for me to go & my parting feedback
Ironically, she complains about the game becoming ptw, and that it was difficult for her to reach for #1 but it DID show that she reached top 10ā€¦unless she was lying about being FTP, which I didnā€™t witness in six months with the alliance.

"With 36 flasks accumulated over 3 months I was able to reach #8. If I got knocked out of top 10 that time Iā€™d probably feed Elkanen to Leonidas for ultimate saltiness (it was before Leoā€™s buff).

But I know that without refills, Falcon, Jackal, I could never compete for #1. Iā€™d need more luck and more skill than anyone with the right composition. And thatā€™s not a fair competition, simply put. Not to mention, without refills, my luck-factor is severely gimped and I do not think my skill is superior to the top players. Could I reach their level? Maybe. I will never find out. Because even if I did, Iā€™d never climb to their level to know, as my hero stable is subpar, and my compositions are limited."

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ā€œTriton jackal and gretelā€

Very interesting 3 heroes unobtainable from tc20

You need to stop arguing about whether F2P players can compete or not in events and just accept the fact that this game is as p2w as it gets

wrong. a lot of players coming to this game from other games where p2w factor is much worse. No one has spent 1 million dollars on E&P yet that Iā€™m aware of, and that did happen on another game.

How dillusional do you have to be? Does someone need to spend 1 million dollars on a mobile game for you to be able to say this game is pay to win

ā€œIn some multiplayer free-to-play games, players who are willing to pay for special items or downloadable content may be able to gain a significant advantage over those playing for free. Critics of such games call them " pay-to-win "

lol sounds like you dont even like the game. If thatā€™s the case then why are you even wasting your time? Not understanding how/why someone would not be able to find something better to do with their time than play a game they dont like or even discuss a game they dont like. It would be like me going to a classical music forum and talking about how much i dislike it.

So I guess you agree

Thanks