All mana speeds are set to very fast-there isn’t a change to mana in general.
This is still your friend. Just check out the very fast info.
All mana speeds are set to very fast-there isn’t a change to mana in general.
This is still your friend. Just check out the very fast info.
I think that the outcome would have been the same going 3-2 or 2-2-1 Unless you have picked purple heroes you wouldn´t have charged any hero anyway. maybe going mono you´d have killed Telluria.
Ok but how many of those heroes do you really think they have? A player like you’re describing might be able to put a more effective defense team together but they’re not going to be padding all of their attack teams with slow heroes - maybe one or two teams, but the rest of their hits are going to be with the same heroes they’ve always used, fighting optimized defenses smashing them for the
rest of the war.
Not to get too personal here, but you’ve played for almost three years, yes? You may not be blessed with a “top bench” but I think you can still admit that you’ve likely got a deeper bench than similar players who haven’t played as long, and these are the players I’m attempting to defend - I said it in my original reply, “unless a person has spent a couple of years and/or sufficient money on this game…”. Take your roster and cut it in half, or a third, those are the players I’m referring to.
I don’t see the counter argument here, it sounds like we’re saying the same thing in different ways. Players who can’t build a meta team still have to fight meta teams, and have prioritized their roster for that. This war rule throws the meta out the window and as a result their roster is disadvantaged against this war rule. They may have some back-up heroes that apply, but the majority of their roster will still be aimed at an entirely different set of rules, a different breed of defender, and very likely a different style of attack.
But going back to my earlier point, it still takes a long time to get those heroes. Longer than the year that I’ve been at it, obviously. Alliance Wars are for everyone, I shouldn’t have to have 2 years in the game to be competitive. And only 12 heroes in TC20 are the strong slows emphasized in these wars (out of 42 possible 4 & 5*), and 8 of those 12 are 5* that come few and far between.
In theory I agree with you. In practice for wars I think it falls apart. Rush Tournaments work because of the additional element and rarity restrictions to narrow the hero pool, but with Rush Wars being wide open to all heroes that extra balancing mechanism is gone.
It seems like lot of long-term players don’t seem to realize or remember, but for many players, wars were already plenty of a challenge as they were. Developing midgame players can already struggle to maximize teams for different war rules or mitigate their survival when things go badly. For them, this is just an extra layer of frustration to be reminded that their level of player isn’t even considered for changes like this, as well as feeling just a little bit more “behind” now as a result.
I assure you that we are speaking the same language, and you know that TC20 is notoriously both stingy and streaky, and you’ve also played 3x longer than I have haha. I’ve gotten a few good avg/fast speed but yes only one slow. One of my teammates has had two TC20 running for a looong time and just got his first 5* since June. I’m glad you’ve been so lucky, but you have to realize that everyone else is not necessarily in the same situation.
No comment
But regarding your tileplay, I don’t mean this to sound rude but none of that sounds very unique. Some skill, some forethought, some luck, some calculated risk… You said you have all of the S1 slows, surely you realize that your roster is carrying at least equal weight to your tile skills if you can always place top 1 or 5% in rush tourneys. Have you placed as well in, say, rush 5* with no element restrictions, using only avg/fast speed 4*s & 5*s all scattered between 3/60-70 to partially emblemed? That would be the the closest equivalent, and I applaud you if so (and bonus points if they were mostly S1s )
Sorry, maybe I was ambiguous. I’m not saying synergy isn’t important, I’m saying that it’s a basic skill that players start learning pretty early in the game (maybe at least by a few months in?). We’re all always learning in that regard, but I don’t think it’s fair or accurate to assume that players must not know about synergy just because they have fewer heroes or less gametime or struggle to compete with stronger players.They know about synergy because they have to in order to compete or complete different game modes as they progress.
I think the more appropriate answer is that they are more limited by their roster, or the mats to improve it, but insinuating that players just don’t know how to properly use what they have is probably received as more insulting than helpful - it’s like telling someone they’re a bad driver when they’ve never been in a car together. idk, synergy is just something that seems like vet players like to accuse growing players of neglecting around here, even as those same growing players are obviously using it, at least for the growth they’ve already seen. It’s dismissive and uninformed, might as well just tell them “git gud”.
Fair enough, I won’t deny you that.
For some of us, this war was miserable.
Alliance Wars are supposed to be something for players as low as level 12. We have teammates in the 50s and 60s who can’t make a decent use of this war rule. Throwing-back to the poll at the top of this thread, and re-iterating what @FraVit93 & @Mr_Style_Points said above, the idea of equal charging speed for every hero isn’t an inherently bad thing, but why does it have to be very fast - the absolutely hardest setting? This idea could easily be implemented in a less unforgiving way - honestly ANY other charge speed would be less punishing than very fast.
If they really wanted to emphasize things like tileplay and synergy these would be Very Slow Wars (Turtle Tussles? lol), so they’d take forever to charge and it better count when you do. But the point being, if Alliance Wars are supposed to be for everyone (and I think we both agree that many other game modes are not intended for the same level 12 threshold), then there should be more effort to include the lowest common denominator so all players can find relevance here. It would even be an improvement if the featured charging speed was on a rotating schedule.
Like I mentioned before, I don’t hate this as much as some players do, but I will say that didn’t enjoy it - and I love wars. And even as meager as it may be, I’m also probably in a better position to deal with these Rush Wars than many of my teammates, and their frustrations were palpable before they ever posted a thing in chat, you could see it all over the field and scoreboard: almost every fight was a binary “all or none” in hit after hit. The standard one-two punch to break a tank and then cleanup wasn’t even materializing - teams were either obliterated quickly with 1 flag or chipped away slowly with 6. Maybe you saw more variation at your level, but a lot of us who were just trying to tread water in this war were completely at the mercy of the board - thankfully it was at least more merciful to us than our opponents last time, but it still doesn’t make us feel any better about it going forward.
I have to say I like the new war rule and my chameleon agrees. Unfortunately we lost and scored lower than usual (about 4.8k… usually we score around 5.4-5.8k).
I was thinking if it might be a good idea to forget about a unified tank color for rush war. I think it really comes down to the board at rush attack. The tank is good and can charge quickly. We usually have green tanks but not all of us have Telly or Heimdall. So ask myself if it would really weaken us that much if I allow my alliance mates to use their Kunchen as tank instead of Lianna or Elkanen… What do you think? Could this war rule favor overall strong (slow) tanks over using the same color? I think our opponent had mixed colors as well…
Just my opinion, but I would say yes… We do pretty well in wars without a coordinated tank color, while the opponents we see tend to run a common tank color.
My understanding of the common tank color is to deplete the attackers who stack against that color so they run out of appropriate heroes, while using tile damage (as a primary method) to kill the tank. But with very fast mana, you can start using rainbow attack teams if all you need are 2 matches to charge specials. Now it doesn’t really matter what the tank color is if you’re going to defeat it by making a few matches and killing it with specials.
But, just my opinion.
A lot of people (Specially in the PT/BR community) have been asking my opinion regarding the Rush War, I’ve been answering punctually (sometimes in details, sometime more on the surface) and I’ve seen some of my answers being forwarded around in different groups so I decided to post on the forums exposing my opinion in a general way.
We have over 140 heroes in the game, each with his unique special (with a few exceptions), I’ve always commented that it doesn’t have to be this way, we have a few examples of elegant game design where the same skill is used by more than one hero in different elements. We can see those cases in Sonya/Caedmon, Panther/Evelyn/Frida, Sabina/Melendor, Tiburtus/Gromke/Grimm. They all have solid well-designed skills and having them in more than one element allows for versatility. I sincerely don’t understand the reasoning behind the way Small Giant chose to things, I always say that we don’t need for each new hero that comes out to have new and innovative skill, better and more powerful (especially because it will be not sustainable on the long run and would lead to the game dying out, but that’s a topic for another day…). We can easily see examples of this “Elegant Design” I spoke about could be easily be seen, we had a hero of a certain rarity with a certain skill and, in the same element, a rarer hero brought a skill in the same format but more powerful, just take a look at heroes like Hu Tao/Justice, Colen/Azlar, Ulmer/Isarnia, Skittle-Skull/Horghall, Chao/Leonidas, etc…
Throughout the years, new heroes started being released and small giant gravitated away from this format, the heroes started gaining shinning new skills and as a result we ended up getting Average or even Fast mana heroes with skills that are much more impactful than that of slow ones, which led to the obsolescence of some heroes as inventories grew and evolved.
Small Giant realized that the usage of slow heroes (as well as the search for them) was a constant decline and introduced new forms of game where those heroes would be useful, that’s how the “Rush Attack” weekly tournament came to life, thing is we now also have a war in the same format.
I wrote a Guide about Rush war Mechanics, Troops and team Structure, once again, It’s in Portuguese and spreading through the PT/BR community as we speak, I can translate it and post on the appropriate section if it is of interest.
I didn’t like the format personally (And it’s not as if I did bad, we were up against Aggressive II and I went 6 for 6, the video is here in case anyone is interested: [Guerra Narrada]Oceano Pacífico X Aggressive II - YouTube), I sincerely think that creating an entire format as an attempt to “mitigate” the discrepancy in power level amongst heroes (something that’s been brewing throughout the years) was kind of a lazy solution. We have a MetaGame where some heroes are highly coveted while others are avoided and considered to be borderline useless, creating a different, unbalanced Meta in order to viabilize heroes that are not viable in the first one is not a solution.
As I always say, this is my opnion, it’s not absolute. I know people that liked the format, I know people that hated it (I find it idiotic) and I know people that said “ok, enough, I’m fed up” and stopped playing altogether, for them it was the straw tha broke the camel’s back (In Oceano Pacifico we had 3 such cases). It’s not my case, I’m not saying I’ll stop playing or stop participating in wars, what I’m saying is that taking an existing problem and simply reversing it so it will still exist, but opposite from what it initially was is not a solution.
Well, for those who wanted my opinion, here it is, I find the format porrly designed and I think Small Giant is capable of doing much, much better, but I understand that some people will like it.
Best Regards
Jairo Aragão – Trovão
Jabarj from Oceano Pacifico
The rush wars are a bigger joke than the initial release of telluria.
I honestly liked the rush war same as i kinda like rush tournaments and do not think it is just a “easy solution”.
It’s a “cleaver” solution for me, as making some heroes stronger only in some context and not everywhere is the best way to diversify gameplay.
That said, i really liked your post and respect your point of view.
Quite sad people leave because of this, but can’t really understand why.
Yes, your usual heroes are not strong everywhere anymore and you may have to keep chasing/leveling your deck, but that’s what keep your game fresh, not the other way around.
Sit on your great heroes and complaint they are not as useful as before is quite a lame reason to drop, personally speaking.
I really like the rush tourneys; however, I personally wish that they didn’t copy and paste the rush into war. It takes away some of the novelty.
Instead of making everybody very fast, I was hoping that everybody, except for very fast heroes, get a step down in mana speed. For example, very slow → slow, slow–> average, and so forth. I think that would bring more strategy to the game. However, that’s just my opinion.
I like this war format and I’m a veteran player too. All people I talked too liked this format.
I saw you video. All 6 of your targets were easy, next time choose an Afrike team.
But it is. Rather than properly balance heroes based on speed, you just set everyone to the same speed. That’s inherently the “easy solution.” Hint, if slow heroes take twice the tiles to charge as v fast heroes, why don’t their specials do twice the effect (damage or otherwise)?
And it removes skill from gameplay. Because if you have a bad or mediocre board there’s zero chance to recover. You have 2-3 matches to gain or lose advantage. That’s it. At least normally even a bad board gives 6-8 matches to change things.
I dislike it because it’s a lame solution to their mistakes in design. I hate it because it removes skill from play.
The only good thing is the matches are fast.
It is undeniably true that recover from a bad board in this format is quite difficult.
As such, it is extremely board dependent.
Not saying it must be this way to “rebalance” slower heroes and bring them back from the shadows.
I quite like @rity proposition and also think making something new rather then place the same dish on a different table could be even better.
Of course for Small Giant is easier this way.
But out of the many things they could add/change to the game to make slower heroes again relevant, i don’t particulary dislike this solution.
I like the idea. The way I see it, there are two kinds of players who have maxed slow 5* heroes:
Rush tournaments and wars give them all a chance to get a better ROI.
IMO, the group of players is so large and diverse that no feature will ever be met with 100% consensus, so how about we simply enjoy every new change and challenge? It’s one thing to ask for improvement on something you don’t like, and quite another to ask for it to be eliminated.
(Not directed at anyone in particular, just a general remark)
Absolutely, good part of my alliance if ftp and finally found use for their multiple maxed hu Tao etc., their defenses were on par or even better than the ones who pay and feed their season1 heroes to event heroes and hotm, running their tc20 for a year and more. I’m happy for them since some are with me for nearly 2 years having at best 10 none season1 5stars or waiting for their first proteus since forever. And to those who don’t like it, it’s only twice in 2 months, so what
Beside that it is something different, something refreshing from doing the same all the time in war and finally my beloved Snow White rules on d
I think there are 2 major causes of disappointment with this kind of war:
_ Board dependency: I think it´s common agreement that this attack is more about the boards than others, people who love strategy and planned matches don´t find it fun. People who get bad boards and people who think that RNG is against them won´t like this aswell.
_ Teams assembling: Many people spend a lot of time and resources building teams for wars, levelling them priorizing some heroes over others, several people feel their effor thrown through the window when seeing this.
There is also an extra feature: There are only 2 co operative game modes in this game: Wars and titans, many people put a lot of energy and feel pressured to do their part in them, having these kind of wars is adding more salt to the wound.
I don´t know about other´s rosters: mine is quite thin, and several of them are dupes (I have 5 4* blues and have double Kiril and double Boril; I have 6 4* purple (only 3 maxed and 1 close to max) 2 of them are dupes.
Not a veteran player, not a deep bench yet. I still like it, makes you try different strategies.
I HATE rush tournaments, but I love rush wars.
Main difference is that there is no banned color, so you can still effectively stack against the tank. In tournaments with prohibited colors you can almost never prevent a tank from firing.
Also, in rush tournaments you cant fill your own mana in 2 moves except for 5 star rush, so you are even more at a disadvantage.
In war with lvl 11 mana troops you can charge in 2 moves, wich gives you way more favorable odds. I ran rainbow the whole time so every move I made was meaningfull. No dead tiles. It made it more about skill then luck, though luck plays a part still, just not a huge factor.
Rush tournaments can rot in a dark place, rush wars are much more enjoyable and less luck based than everyone makes it out to be.
I disagree. There is skill in selecting you defense team and skill in selecting your offense. Nittany Lion proved a while ago that there is much less skill in board manipulation than we want to believe.
What it does do is remove alot of the advantage that ppl who have spent to build very fast rosters have. It drives diversity as GM (and other very fast heroes) is meh when every other hero is very fast.
I’m a mono player in wars, it’s just much easier for me to synergise teams this way.
As such rush anything tends to be boom or bust. But that’s on me and my playstyle.
One of our alliance went 6-6 playing Rainbow teams. Blew my mind but it happened we weren’t against slouches. 12 teams 4600+ out of 27 and lowest defence was a 4100.
So rush wars can be played strategically if you set out to do so.
Or you can be lazy like me and just play it the same and hope the RNG gods are on your side