New mana per turn calculation on defense? We investigate Vol 2

Yes, but class bonus works in offense, so if you’re using your tank as a support hero in offense team, class bonus is useful. Usually alternative to 2% mana bonus is +Crit, which is even more useless, so I’d still pick up 2% mana bonus.

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Every tile without combo gives only 2/3 of a regular tile. Combo tiles give 90% less mana for every combo level, so combo 2 gives 90% of regular tile, combo 3 gives 81% of regular tile, etc.

Do you mean “Combo tiles give 10% less mana for every combo level”? Which would be the same as Combo tiles give 90% mana of previous combo level.

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Exactly. I rephrased the original post, too. Probably was too sleepy when posted that :slight_smile: Thanks for the correction!

@Petri Any chance you could verify this statement?

It is basically saying that e.g. the 5% mana bonus I get from a maxed costume or the 4% mana bonus from a node 20 emblemed Vela does not have any influence (is ignored) on charging speed if this hero is part of your defense team. :thinking: Kinda doubtful, but who knows. :man_shrugging:

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@Damirius thanks for your work, can guess it took a lof recordings to figure out all this. Can you please share videos ( proof ) especially the ones verifying class mana nodes and costumes mana bonus not considered on defense?

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You can look at the screenshots in the Mana mechanics guide.
I can even post one right here:

Here you can see that Joon (which is a costume with 19 emblems) has exactly the same mana amount after 1 turn without being hit, as Vela with 19 emblems, they both have lvl 23 mana troops.

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@Damirius

Hmnnn. I checked the player’s defense from Haus der Moiren [HDM] and the only player having the same defensive setup is Wuisel05. Both Vela and Joon are supported by level 23 mana troops indeed. But there is no evidence that costumed Joon’s 19th node is the mana bonus as it may be the critical bonus. If costumed Joon’s 19th node is crit bonus, then it will explain why he has the same amount of mana gathered with Vela. But then, we don’t have evidence that the 19th node is the mana bonus. But then again, we should consider the costume mana bonus of 5% of Joon. Well spotted. It gives credence to your claim.

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Yes, it’s Wuisel05.
Here’s the video of the attack:

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@Aquaginera_7DD With all due respect, do you have something as a rebuttal to @Damirius’ proof? If confirmed by SG, it may be something on offense but the +20 node on defense, it would be useless. Unless it is considered as a bug by SG and subsequently fix it. I pray it is working as intended though in order for the majority of us to spend those 250 emblems on other heroes.

But, as you remark in your previous post, this only proves that costume bonus is not applied. Class bonus for both Vela and Joon in this case maybe is not in the discussion.

All depends on the path of that Joon, if it is the mana bonus path, then it seems to be true that, in defense, the bonuses are not taken in account.

From this, it seems that costume mana bonus does not affect passive mana generation on defense. Does the costume mana bonus also not influence the mana generation when the hero is hit with tiles?

Also, I wonder if this is the intented mechanism of costume bonus, or a bug…? It’d be great if SG was more transparent with the exact mechanism/maths

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So far I couldn’t find any differences in mana generation for Vela and Joon in that team. They were hit with the same tiles and gained equal amount of mana.

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By measuring exact mana gained from various actions, I found out that either all heroes I measured did not choose mana node in talent tree, or class mana bonus did not apply. Mana gains were consistent with base troop bonus, not with +2% from class bonus.

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Ok! so you´ve checked this more times and was consistent.

Then it seems to be true, this is very important considering the high cost of the last tier of the class tree, so ¡¡I´m truly grateful for the time you´ve dedicated on this!!

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@Damirius Do you have some videos with Vela+20? She gets +4% mana bonus from it and as it is the only choice you can be sure she really has +4% (unlike monks who get +2% at node 19 but this node has other option too).

I got two videos (where I know talent nodes and troops) today, so I’ll try to measure it by myself too. I am really curious about if it works or not.

Costume bonus not being added is weird and I hope it’ll get posted to #bugs-issues or reported via ticket soon

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I did already. Hoping to hear back from SG soon. :slight_smile:

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No, I don’t have videos with Vela +20. I actually would like my mana findings to be independently confirmed or busted.

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I hope we get a reply from sg, i’m using some costume heroes in my defense team and i emblemed and put them there BECAUSE of the mana bonus with specific troops…

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Bumping this because it seems like a very important issue and i’d like to know if anyone got an answer from sg.

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I am watching this topic too and looking forward to some official answer… I guess holidays won’t help for a while though…

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