Mana Class Talent and Costume Mana Bonus DO Work in Defense - Staff Response Post #90

I don’t know why you’re taking this tone, of course I read the original post.

Do you have an answer or just snark?

In the original thread that spawned this one, @Aquaginera_7DD found a difference in mana breakpoints between offense & defense, if this doesn’t explain it then what does?

Of course I understand that Petri inadvertently kicked a bee hive with his erroneous post, but that doesn’t explain the observed differences in mana gain that Aqua has been posting about for a year.

I certainly might have missed it (with 270 posts spread over 2 threads), but if you don’t want to help me then do us both a favor and just ignore me.

Scroll up a few posts and you’ll see I’m not the only person confused about this.

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I’m saying if we look at passive mana generation alone, the 4% mana bonus ontop of costume bonus and lvl 29+ mana troop won’t lead to firing a round earlier compared to just mana troop and costume bonus. As an analogy since I don’t have actual numbers, let’s say a hero starts with 0 mana and fires at 100 mana. If a hero gains 10 mana per turn, it will take 10 turns to fire. If a hero gains 11 mana per turn, it will still take 10 turns to fire.

Ofc this won’t be the case if mana from tiles hitting the hero were included. However, I don’t believe it is confirmed yet that the mana bonus node affects tiles hitting the hero. Petri’s example only shows that it affects passive mana generation.

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Hold on i got this lol

Then petri responded saying that is intended by game designers

Then game designers came back and said no no no, the bonuses are working(or are supposed to anyways)

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So there was an error in Aqua’s original calculations? She was observing a real difference for mana charge on offense vs defense, wasn’t she?

Mana charge on defense has always been different than offense as far as i know

The problem came up when it seemed like heroes on defense were charging the same rate whether they had talent/costume bonuses or not which would mean the bonuses weren’t being applied at least that seemed to be the case to players

I’d have to go back and re read everything again to see if this changed anything aqua originally calc’d

I’m at work so that would take more uninterrupted time than i can afford at the moment

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No worries, thanks for the explanation

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Aqua started the thread (important one btw) one year ago with defense mana calculations theories and observations. It was Damirius (to my understanding when reading through it) who made more recently detailed observations and calculations and stated that these observations showed no mana speed increase on defense from class/costume bonuses.

I also think the most transparent would be to get more detail on this from SG.

Or as Damirius himself requested - independent research from someone else to confirm or deny his findings. I guess passive mana gain per turn was clarified by Petri, but too wonder about the tile hits.

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And to think, if we had custom arenas where we could setup our opponents (or practice against alliance members) any way we want, then we could have much more easily tested this.

Seems SGG already have an in-house version of it too.

FeelsBadMan :neutral_face: :confused: :disappointed:

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The post below and Damirius’ research (Mana mechanics with almost exact numbers) was the source of the original discrepancy. I then submitted a support tickets, asking for further clarification on the matter.

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He :slight_smile:

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As i read it, attack and defence mana gain difference coming from an attack/defence different mana calculation, and not because bonuses are not applied on defence.

Those bonuses simply impact mana differently depending you are attack or defence.

While this is somehow comforting (not bug or misleading informations occured) doesn’t change the fact that not knowing the clear formula behind it we are not able to evaluate if it’s worth taking a mana node or not on a talent, or replace a HotM with a costumed hero in defence.

That’s quite still a problem, as we are not able to discern our own heroes values.

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Thanks, I didn’t realize there were two data streams there. Maybe Damirius has parsed things out a bit more since then.

whoops, sorry man :man_facepalming:

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I will need to repeat my mana investigation on the new version of game to make sure that class bonus and costume bonus works. Probably will do that on this weekend.

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Joon should have been 128-130 in that pixel count. I’m thinking it needs corroborated and/or SG need to double-check other costume/class/speed combinations on this. Seems like there could be a bug somewhere.

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I’m just going to say this as I’ve already said my piece earlier…but I sincerely hope anyone on this thread doesn’t spend any$ on pulls from now on weather in costume Valhalla or Atlantis…even element…SG doesn’t deserve another Penny until this is changed… they easily nerfed telluria after getting an insane amount of$ from her gave us emblems that probably alot (including myself) of ppl used in mana node’s…so they can change this and should ASAP or we band together all the people who have ever spent anything on costume pulls weather it be 1 or 1000 and boycott SG until it’s fixed…or compensated for this blatant misleading information about costume and talent mana speed bonuses…“working as intended” should be any time a hero is used with any mana speed boost! Period

Think you missed an update there @OGdirty1Kanobi

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My humble apologies if I’ve misunderstood the complete picture.

Mana increase rate on costumes and emblem nodes DOES get added on defense in a passive manner (incremental increase per turn); however I’m uncertain as to whether costume and emblem mana boost works as described on tile impact on defense.

Is this still under a cloud or did I miss an explanation?

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Thank you, this is my most desired new feature that i believe could be quite easily implemented and bring another new dimensions into alliance play. I dont understand why we still dont have this, but the devs have time to work on ToLs and ninja towers (ok i know, money). This is one of those QoL improvements some of the veterans here on the forum asked for.

And as you rightly pointed out, this would help so much for the great researchers here to better understand the formulas (especially if SG dont want to hand them to us on a plate).

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Yeah missed that lol well hopefully they fix it soon and have it work the way it should both ways and talent node’s… just know alot of ppl including myself have spent$ in costumes especially for that bonus…if that’s done then hopefully anything in future should be more clarified for all to see exactly what they should expect, easy to get heated and miss thing’s…I still think that ppl should spend within their means as let’s face it you could do a few hundred pulls and not get the hero you want but if you do should get everything you’re expecting… but it’s a pretty big thing to just not mention to everyone, but still love the game and community… just wanting what’s best for everyone and hopefully SG will to :smile: I understand it’s a business for SG and it’s a game for us. But there should be a mutual respect for both the devs and players alike…I really hope to see this happening for everyone’s sake…SG should prosper under the Moto of meeting players expectations to a degree that it’s enjoyable and transparent

BUMPING THIS IN CAPITALS

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