Kunchen vs Aeron


#21

Clarifying one mechanic on Kunchen:

  1. He is always immune to generic -defense, e.g. Isarnia.
  2. Once he casts, he and all dark allies are immune Have a countervailing defense to holy -defense, e.g. Jackal, for 6 turns.
  3. Neither immunity can be dispelled

#22

are you sure about Jackal? I thought Kunchen was immune only to standard defense down (from Grimm, Athena and Buddy for instance), but not from elemental defense down (from Jackal, Evelyn, etc.). It was changed in beta, where originally he was immune to all defense downs.


#23

‘Doesn’t apply to status ailments affecting elemental defence’


#24

Jackal does lower his holy defense but i think that changes once kunchen fires his holy defense buff

The resist doesnt work against jackal

The special skill does

If i’m understanding @Kerridoc correctly


#25

@Kerridoc I want everything you said to be true lol here is a gameplay screen cap against Jackal.


I don’t have Aeron so of course Kunchen is my choice


#26

Lowering defense by 8% is still better than 54% tho

Shouldnt apply at all in my opinion. Remember the good ol days when SG would come up with cut n dry special skills? I miss those days…


#27

i was just thinking that @Rigs it almost negates Jackal, and Jackal seems to be all anyone down grading Kunchen is talking about. Personally I have him at 3 70 so haven’t seen his full effectiveness but I really like him and it is killing me that I don’t have GP to pair him with. I am also working on getting my mana troop to 17 to take care of the slow issue.


#28

Jackal is only yellow elemental defense debuffer until wonderland comes out. Then we’ll see another hero that loopholes kunchens skill.

Here’s a question:

Do defense buffs stack with the bunnies defense debuff? Because if not then that’s a similar mechanic to kunchens, and jackal’s elemental debuff shouldnt stack with kunchens buff. Indispellable is indespellable. I dont have the bunnies to test it myself.


#29

Element link has always kinda been its own thing that stacks with similar buffs/debuffs. The original att/def buff EL stacked with other att/def buffs/debuffs, the healing EL stacked with HOT, and so I’d also expect the elemental EL to stack with other elemental buffs/debuffs.

Speaking of which, Kunchen + Boomer or Kunchen + Domitia on defense might really screw with a mono yellow team if they can cast in time. :slight_smile:


#30

Good catch. Ive edited my post. Not immune, but it balances out.


#31

point 1. is still quite wrong


#32

I believe that is Grimm/Gormek/Tibby and specifically NOT Jackal. The text (as @FrenziedEye shows) specifically excludes Jackal and the other element defense down heroes.


#33

Eh i guess.

Just seems kind of pointless to give him that resistance when there is only 1 yellow hero that drops defense and that 1 yellow hero beats the immunity. Then the same hero beats the special skill as well.

His heals + defense debuff are his perks. Rest is crap that looks good on paper but in actuality is pretty useless.

Plus very fast mana vs slow mana = death of kunchen unless board is so bad that you cant even line up 6 yellow tiles in 3 to 4 moves.

If he was average mana i probably would have already spent to snag him and max him just for the heals and defense debuff

But 3 useless perks + slow mana, yea sounds like aeron is the better hero so far


#34

Agreed that Aeron is the better hero, particularly on raid offense. I have him maxed and use him for probably half of my raids due to the high number of debuffing/DOTing heroes in Diamond tier. In that environment, an average-speed multi-use shield is better than a slow one-time cleanse in my book.

Kunchen might still be useful against high-level titans where mana pots make his speed less of a detriment.


#35

Yea titans is where i think he’ll shine the most as well


#36

My issue with this statement and all statements on Jackal is that the same is exactly true for Aeron? Line up a few yellows and both are dead.

Aeron will get his special off faster of course but is almost as vulnerable


#37

Average mana doesnt require as bad of a board to fire. And once aeron does fire, jackal isnt an exception to his special skill because SG used to make cut n dry special skills


#38

In the long run forcing attackers to bring G. Jackal would be a good thing.
Tanks would still die against 7-8 stacked element’s tiles but so will 4* heroes at the first special taken.


#39

Joon + jackal would kill kunchen pretty quick and 3/2 stack is a common tactic and more viable than mono in my opinion


#40

So would Joon + Joon, but with better results on multiple targets and with a more durable attacker :slight_smile: