Inari and Mitsuko - Anchor’s thoughts

General Discussion
#103

If by including the extra red you are counting on a bad board as a win condition, I’d argue that a bad board is one of the win conditions for any rainbow team as well. What’s more, her lackluster ability doesn’t punish as hard damage-wise for slow starts as any of the most commonly used tanks. She also lacks a heal to sustain her, like Guin/Del/Aeron.

There is a term in collectible card games called win-more. This term defines cards that are primarily effective when you already have a lead. They do little to turn a game in your favor if you’re even or behind, but can turn a presumptive win into a misleadingly strong blowout. I sincerely believe her to be more of a win-more hero. If they stack against her and get off to a very slow start, those are games you should be winning anyhow With or without her albeit perhaps not by as wide a margin. These wide margins are deceptive in analysis of a heroes effectiveness, because the blowouts are going to be the ones that stand out the most and can therefore lead to false conclusions about efficacy

4 Likes
#104

wish good luck at the beginning of the game that is a lot of purple puzzles, if not just can say bye bye :grin::grin::grin::grin:

#105

we do not stick to proteus, proteus only focuses stops the enemy mana and after that we have to spend it quickly with the attacking hero. the point is we have to move quickly to remove the 2 annoying heroes :grin::grin:

#106

Didn’t think my post was worthy of flagging.

Sorry if I offended - I thought it was obvious I was joking… I’m a massive fan of anchor and all of the 7DD efforts put forward…

1 Like
#107

I couldn’t agree more with you. That’s why we keep seeing the same heroes over and over in every defense line. I get so excited when I can get to see beta heroes as they are originally designed, then I get to dream about them for months or weeks… and then I get to disappointed when the final version comes out. Inari had a 90+ % to dodge specials… that was excellent; I would’ve done anything to get her, but now that it is only 56% I wont even try to go after her. They totally aegir-ized her.

#108

Please do me and everyone else the favor and don’t spread any false rumors like those anymore!

For clarification: Inari has never been at 90+% dodge chance! She was originally at 60+% and 4 turns and 35% att for minions. However, that proved to be OP to the majority of beta players. Hence, SGG nerfed her to her current live version.
Another thing that should be mentioned about beta players is that we don’t test and give feedback for our own benefit. We do it (in our free time, for no payment or else) to keep E&P balanced and fun to play. Don’t forget that SGG always has the final word on any released hero. E.g. Victor: His final beta version was way different than his current live version, even though none of the beta players thought his final beta version was too OP.

Just keep that in mind and try to be a little more cautious when you decide to bash beta players the next time…

6 Likes
#109

It doesn’t need to be a thought experiment :slight_smile: look at Proteus. Is he or is he not one of the best 4*s? His damage is pretty minuscule

1 Like
#110

Love me some Proteus.

1 Like
#111

Inari was never 90+%. She was at 76%. And the strategies to beat her on defense were exactly the same as they are with her special at 56%. The only effect that nerf had was offensively

1 Like
#112

Screenshot_20181123-064515_Gallery
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She was 90+% I didn’t download that image when it was circulating so I can’t really prove it. Found the one when she was at 73%.

I apologize the for the part that insinuated that it is beta testers fault since I really don’t know how it works. I would still sleep with one eye opened since you can’t trust anyone these days lol :smile:

But the part I still don’t understand is why are the heroes originally designed so powerful and then the story repeats itself? What’s the purpose of it? I mean by now we all know that any beta hero is amazing and that they all get nerfed, wouldn’t it be better to design them in a way that it wouldn’t be so obvious that they’d get nerfed? I smell something being cooked there

#113

Was thinking Zimkitha, Grimm, Mitsuko, Kiril, Guardian Falcon as the defence team. (Swap in Greens for Blues should I pull a good Green 5* as I only have Horghal)

To counter I think you’d consider a 2-3 (green and blue) or a 2-2-1 combo that included Wu Kong.
A Melendor/Caedmon/Sonya would be in the line up of either scenario.

#114

I’ll repeat, she was never 90+%

Also note, her fox minions didn’t give mana previously. She wasn’t just nerfed. She was actually buffed, a lot before her nerf. The drop to 56% percent happened because her minions started giving mana. And at first the minions have 10% mana. At 73% dodge and 10% mana per minion she was absolutely bonkers. You lost raids because you couldn’t kill anyone and time ran out

5 Likes
#115

Inari looks great for defense and for Titans, imagine being able to reflect a special from a 10* dragon…!!!

In raids, I think a BT/Wu Kong combination can be a good option to counter her.

#116

Ok, I know this is deviating from the original intention of the post but the question still remains: why are they originally designed to be so over powered? I’m a designer myself for a very different type or industry, you dont over design a bridge and then start taking parts out. The whole nerf-ation on all new heroes looks bad, it’s a story that gets old, it’s already old.

#117

Yeah I’m not sure on that front either. Some of their design moves have been truly head scratching. However this Betas off late have been better. We have had to ask for heroes to be buffed more then nerfed. I don’t believe anyone has gotten seriously nerfed since Inari

#118

Her minions were at 90+% attack at one time, but never the dodge percentage. :slight_smile:

I understand your point, but I also believe it is rather difficult for developers and SGG to get a hero with a totally new ability right the first time. And that’s what beta is for.

If a new hero with already existing/similar special skills would be created, I reckon there won’t be much adjustment needed (e.g. Evelyn). But Inari’s special skill is unique as of right now, hence it is just logical that it needs more adjustment than „usual“. And let’s be honest… no matter how much you think about it upfront, some things you’ll only notice when actually playing/testing her in-game. And that’s what beta testers with a broad hero knowledge are there for. :slight_smile:

#119

@vahmur If you think Inari is useless, you haven’t read this thread :wink:

#120

Well, if you nerf a bridge lives will be lost, so the comparison is not good.

And each new hero has to be unique, specially 4* and 5* ones, they have to be nice (or badass) looking, and their specials have to be something new, but that works well with other heroes abilities, without being unbeatable, that’s called balance.

In other words, they need to have enough appeal to make them spending worthy, while making sure they won’t make their teams invincible, so only who pays (or is HUGELY lucky) to get them is at the top of the “food chain”.

#121

As my roster of 5* heroes is yet kind of thin, Inari and Mitsuko feel kinda useless to me. Saving pulls for christmas. I guess Inari’s ability is good for players at the extreme end of the end game so to speak, but I just don’t see the point of pouring limited resources into this gate.

1 Like
#122

I don’t know how to quote :laughing:

Anyways, I think you have very valid points but when you say “and that’s what beta testers with a broad hero knowledge are there for” it brings us back to the first point… making beta testers be/look like the bad guy of the movie. I’m sure there are buffs on heroes after beta but unfortunately the negative changes are noticed in a bigger way. Maybe it’s just human nature, we tend to focus more of the negative aspects but imo the way heroes get nerfed is much bigger and way more frequent that any of the buffs the might get. I dont really keep scores to prove it but I think that’s the common feeling.

We love this game and I know you and others have a huge knowledge about it and about heroes… but aren’t they as creators supposed to have an equal amount of knowledge and hopefully even higher? I agree on it being difficult when heroes with new abilities are designed but they need to do a better job. It makes them look like they are willing to compromise every aspect of their original design and it reminds me of Margaret Thatcher saying: consensus is like mixing all the ingredients but not necessarily coming out with a cake.

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