Hit/affect nearby heroes change to hit/affect three heroes max with V42

In the latest Beta version something remarkable is being tested:

effects that target nearby allies or nearby enemies can hit max three targets

More detailed information is given in the according Beta beat (starting from post #69 - thanks @PlayForFun for maintaining the Beta beats :+1:):

As therein are more things summarized that are tested right now, this change that might be in the offing could easily be overlooked (unintentional for sure :face_with_monocle:).
However, i think this topic is of major interest and will effect lots of players and their decisions and hence i think it reasonable to have a separate topic on this to discuss.

It is still unknown, whether this change will be introduced and afaik beta feedback is all-negative about it. SG did not state their intention for this test (only rumor is, it might be in preparation for wars with formation?!) or whether it is a non-negitionable thing we need to swallow.

If it will be introduced, defending heroes like Sif, Elena and alike will be remarkably nerfed as well as offending top heroes like Gravemaker, Clarissa, Khagan will be.
It is also unknown, whether or not this will affect map stages as well.

Please feel free to share your opinions. Some starters:

  • Would you like this change or not?
  • Did you already spent aethers on heroes you otherwise would not have?
  • Do you rethink your decisions for limit breaking next heroes?
  • Did you max heroes that soon might become less useful?
  • Are there any advantages and you can’t wait for this change to come?

:exclamation:UPDATE:exclamation:
According to release notes of V42, the change is going live (changed the title as well):

  • Nearby radius reduced. Effects that target nearby allies or nearby enemies can hit only the closest targets in the formations, a maximum of 3 targets but less if no targets are nearby. This affects Double and Reverse Double defense formations in Raids and some enemy formations in player versus environment battles. This will be enabled only after all players have updated to the latest version so it takes effect for everyone at the same time
5 Likes

Adding a small poll for a better overlook:

  • What the heck? Are you serious? We don’t need this change.
  • Yay, finally this will be repaired. Thanks, SG.
  • Aaargh… I just broke Sif. Please bring limit breaker resets asap.
  • Alas, i don’t mind, the game is coming to an end soon.

0 voters

The one format where sif actually becomes really terrifying they want to ruin it for her. I’ll laugh if this exact issue has been flagged as a bug

Personally, I don’t have a problem with this change. Specified clarity as described is fine by me.

If a hero is a hit target & nearby = for me that is a hit 3 hero & design / stats are made accordingly = higher than a hit all hero.
So
When this hero impacts all 5 heroes with the power / design of a hit3 hero, it is unfair, especially for those players who don’t have many such heroes.

I was anticipating this & hence ain’t surprised. Also, hit3 fellows become hit all in very limited circumstances & at level I play, I rarely deal with those formations, bcoz, most fellows are smart & keep reverse formations :smile:

I am amazed that a hit3 hero was limit broken for becoming hit all or rather was LB for being a brilliant hit3 / impacting as per actual hero design… seriously,… how is this any logic !
Example, For me, Sif still stays a brilliant hero, in line for 3rd set of LBs…

Bottom line, remove vague definitions from the design & make things accurate = in line with purpose, design should be a welcome step.

Don’t we all on this forum, regularly keep talking about fairness, so what is the issue here….!?

6 Likes

It’s not though, hit target and nearby doesn’t specify a number of targets. It was always dependent on which hero you targeted and what heroes were beside them.

For a double or reverse double hitting some positions can be just 3,2, or 1 but if targeted on the centre hero all heroes are the same distance from that hero so either all are nearby or none are. This was what it was in the initial testing and the global beta when formations were introduced. Any complaints were from players who hadn’t understood or hadn’t kept up to date with how it worked.

I know you say you don’t see those formations much. I see them fairly regularly when I raid and my cups are around the 25-2600 range normally. However it doesn’t matter how often you see them, players have made decisions to level certain heroes based on how the formations worked and how they can best use their roster. This is pulling the rug out from under them

12 Likes

When you say “remarkably nerfed” you mean reverting back to how they were originally designed to be…?

It is worth noting, and has been pointed out in the beta beat thread I believe, that in the very first iteration of Beta Testing of Alternative Defence Formations, AoE3 heroes in position 3 only affected positions 2&4…

It was changed in a later beta and the dramatic increase in power for AoE3 heroes was highlighted to developers.

So either a) their data has finally caught up or b) they noticed it themselves and are making the change back to their original design.

12 Likes

It’s a broken mechanic, it should be fixed.

3 Likes

I only play in 2600+ cup range.

Hit / impact target & nearby = Hit / impact maximum 3 heroes on own or opposite side is my understanding & if it is being done / rectified, it is fair decision / step. Rationale I have explained in fair amount of detail above.

I am also impacted as I have multiple such heroes who will now become impact target & nearby heroes BUT, I am not upset as that is what the card description says…+ where is the aspect of being nerf applicable in this ?! seriously, unable to see or understand nerfing logic from any angle ! :rofl:

1 Like

Yeah, i might have been not precise enough on that point.
I know this will revert them back to their original design and we were discussing exhaustingly before the introduction of formations whether and how these will affect game balance especially with regard to hit three heroes.

What really annoys me personally is the fact that players made decisions on leveling, embleming and limit breaking after the actual implementation and now this will be a nerf for those heroes. My two cents…

12 Likes

It’s only a matter of time before SG bring out new heroes with passives or specials that have a 100% chance to ignore dodges or counterattacks.

You already know every whale in the game will drop hundreds to chase something like that!

2 Likes

On one side I would be very happy with this change. No more Sif’s, LotL’s or even Brynhilds in the center making a very strong defense that’s quite annoying to play against.

On the other side, I do like to attack these teams as well. My limit broken costume bonus khagan/guardian falcon/proteus/guardian panther/cRana/Buddy/Almur/Mist/etc do love these defenses.

There are a lot more options for the attacking side to bring hit/effect nearby heroes as compared to the defending side which can pretty much only bring effect/buff nearby heroes.

I’m not sure what I would prefer but I think I’m fine with the way it is now.

3 Likes

Hm… :thinking:

The first question I have in mind is whether this will affect characters during map stages.

Reason being that we first saw this discrepancy in map stages with the boss surrounded by lesser enemies. Hit the main boss with a hit-3 special and all were hit. Then we saw raid formations which brought this over.

Personally I don’t think it needs to be ‘changed’ as it’s worked this way for so long anyway, regardless of raids.

6 Likes

Yup I thought of that too. Lol

Maybe they can have different rules for maps. :thinking:

Doubt it.

They will do whatever they want to do. Oh well

1 Like

Actually, i am not sure whether this was considered yet. However, the question was raised in beta forum.
Don’t know whether there are provinces to test it now, i guess those only show up in seasonal events? :thinking:

Cobalt already has this.

Don’t forget Griffin.

I’m pretty sure the Christmas event has a few of these situations.

Yes there are. Can’t remember which ones now.

Some stages have the M formation more often than others.

I think, maybe it is because double formation are more lose over win in statistic, at least in my raid.
SG can track and have records, just like in the past with raid index announcement.

June 2019 → Raid Index
Raids Index trophy Heroes Hall of Fame & Stats!


August 2020 → Raid Index Top 5
All New Raid Index with Updated Heroes trophy August 2020


So, I’m curious statistic for raid defense formation.

2 Likes

Just because that’s your definition doesn’t make it right.

The definition as you note is “NEARBY” and therefore in some places there are 2 nearby and other situations there are 4 possibly more in map stages.

Therefore these heros have different value in different situations. For example a slow hero has more value in a VF war or tournament.

The heros stats and power shouldn’t be exactly the same usefulness in all parts of the game in fact lately they have been designing new things that make that value different in more places, so this change goes against their recent choices.

This is a really awful change that kills many heros and renders the formations for raids pretty much useless. Now we will see almost EVERYONE switching into the reverse formation since the appeal of double is now lost.

4 Likes

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