🕵 Elizabeth – S4 Hero – 5* Fire/ Red: Thoughts, Discussion & Summon Results with Feedback

I was lucky enough to find a 5* red Aether before this last Omega quest. Lizzy was my first choice.

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I would like for her to be nerfed or at least a turn limit on her fiends.

If you alter your team structure and playstyle a bit you can have a heal ready to counter her 95% of the time

Problem is when she launches first and the mana debuff comes before I can get my heal. I can’t even ride it out since it does not go away while having the DoT. The mechanics have to change.

Possibly the mana debuff is separate from the fiend. 2-3 turns for example. But it should not be as long as the fiend stays the debuff and DoT stays.

You can block the mana debuff with ailment protection and you can remove it by healing or even with gazelle/cameleon

There is already existing tools to counter Elisabeth. The easiest is to bring two healers of different color toaximise your chance to have one ready by the time she fires.

It’s not because YOU seem to have a problem to deal with her that she’s OP. She’s not at least much more less than over heroes like for e.g. frigg/morel/odin/finley.

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The others you mentioned are normal powerful heroes. But not unlimited power.

Me too, me too! She’s solid!

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What I find funny is those you mentioned, the only 1 that is OP is Frigg. Frigg combine with or any other heroes makes them OP at least IMO. Elizabeth isn’t Frigg OP being the speeds are slower but I’ve found the same results between the 2 if they go off and I don’t have a counter ready.

Skadi is also OP… if you use a minion team?
Azlar is also OP… if you use 2* heroes? :innocent:

Ahaha… sorry, I think Elizabeth is a really good hero to use on offense. But far from OP on defense.

I used to think how unfair it was that people had Azlar in the defences when I mainly had 3/4*s. My unemblemed, maxed (sigh) Azlar has spent 95% of his life on the bench. Just waiting for that costume to come one day.

Of the current crop of top heroes, Elizabeth is by far the easiest to counter and face in defence.

In the spirit of constructive outputs, may I ask @AirHawk what particular team you went up against (with elizabeth) and lost? Also your roster. Perhaps people here on the forum can help you construct a team to challenge elizabeth teams. Personally, whenever i see elizabeth, i switch to my mono blue team: cKiril-magni-frida-fenrir-lepus. With this team, 3-4 tiles to elizabeth kills her, and 9 tiles charges the whole team which usually ends in a win for me.

Rarely it’s a Liz tank that’s a problem. Winning a team with Liz is also possible. I am just saying the mechanism of Liz’s of her fiends are somewhat broken.

I am curiouos why do you think that Liz’s mechanism is broken, but not Skadi’s? Or do you think they both are?

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Skadi’s skill is powerful once a certain condition is triggered by the opponent. In this case, summoning minions.

Liz’s is different. She cast it and it never ends. Chances of reversing is slim since the mana gen is debuffed. It is even more impossible in the bloody tourney. Deadlier if combined with Uraeus.

At average mana, with those skills she is definitely OP. Unlike Alfrike who is very slow or any of the other newer slow heroes with powerful skills.

I think Elizabeth is a strong offensive hero, but not defensive. I think its ok to have a strong (even OP) hero to use on offense but not to have an OP hero on defense. I think this is why Telly-Vela got nerfed. Because to beat Telly before (at least for me), you would need to stack up on fire heroes which pre-nerf vela specifically punishes. So the x-telly-vela combo then was so abundant, it was the defense of, id say 80-85% of people on the diamond tier on raids. That wasnt good for the game, or much fun at all.

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Once Skadi’s stack takes place, it never ends.

Once Elizabeth’s fiends take place, it ends as soon as a decent heal (< most up-front heals) takes place. Not being tanky and red you most often find her in flank or wing, and being average means that you will 80% of the time have a heal ready by the time she is ready. If you take 2 healers the chance is 95%.

Elizabeth’s ongoing effect is much, much easier to stop than Skadi’s. The only way to stop Skadi’s special is to die and be revived.

Even if she fires and you can’t cleanse it straight away - you will often have your healers close to charged. And you can survive a few turns of her special. On the other hand a Frigg that you can’t counter straight away will lead to your death if just one other heavy hitter hits you.

The solution is - take minimum of 1 healer, ideally 2 healers in different colours. You will find her special is completely negated but on the flip side you get the added benefits of the healer used to counter her (dispel or cleanse or attack up). The net effect of 1 4* hearler > net effect of Elizabeth special

To add: maybe i have a bais for Elizabeth since I do have her and have enjoyed playing with her tremendously. She really shines during ninja tower. Even during that S4 biome where fire heroes get -90% mana gen, i still bring her along (stupidly?), because i just need her to fire only once, and i am willing to spend 3-4 waves throwing red tiles into oblivion just to charge her for the boss wave.

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Winning her and her skills being OP at average mana are 2 different things.

Skadi is not difficult to beat unless you bring minion makers with you or minion wars.

Skadi won’t murder you upfront with below average boards but Liz will.

I tried Elizabeth +20 at tank at the first bloody battle without blue after she came out.

I ended up with a B rank (white rabbit, moreau, cMarjana and Gefjon was the other ones onthe def).

That definitely showed that she’s not OP to me…

Her being average speed is really what’s make her balanced. She is no tank and can only be flank. While it’s not rare that frigg/odin managed to fire more than once it almost never happen that Elizabeth does. If she does well that means that the board was so bad that any other hero at her place would have crush you anyway.

She is not meant to be tank anyway. Average heroes with average mana naturally not for that position.

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