Damage Calculation

Troops can increase the chances of critical hits, but I have not studied this in detail.
As for the titans, because we do not know their exact stats. I think like AMD that the weak point is not related to the critical hits.

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Actually, i Did some tests and the weak spot always critic and the spots next to the weak spot always went strong hit!!!

My bad, sorry!!!

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@SolemnWolf, thank you for what looks like a ton of effort collecting this data!!!

If you look at all the heroes, there is a trade off between attack, defense, and health, in a way that is a more-or-less equal tradeoff.

Iā€™ll use a trainer hero as average/baseline; attach = defense, hp = 1.05 * (att+def).

Scarlett is a glass cannon, with attack = 1.52 * defense, hp = .79 * (att+def)

Kashhrek is a tank, with attack = 0.85 * defense, hp = 1.1 * (att+def)

Both are good heroes, but they are best used in different ways. More general purpose heroes with average balance have their uses as well.

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@SolemnWolf this kind of effort deserves a mighty saga, retold down the agesā€¦or a silly poem.

Iā€™ve plumped for the latter and apologies for any of your colleagues Iā€™ve conveniently ignored.

Some us play tactically,
Some play from the heart
Some just hit Revenge! Revenge!
Which isnā€™t very smart

But beneath this shell of dragons, tiles
And heroes charismatic
The real monster quietly lurks,
A beast of mathematics.

But who can quell this fearsome foe
And learn itā€™s hidden rhythm?
Pick apart itā€™s programmed guts
And bleeding algorithm.

Step forward our friend SolemnWolf
A thinker, not a cheater
He divined a Gaussian law and identified the Theta.

If the attack is found inferior
The damage is compressed
So an attack superior
Is surely for the best.

This leads us, finally, to conclude
That lowering defence
Is by far the better buff
For those who have good sense.

So when you choose your hero,
We are a little wiser.
Pick strong attack that depletes defence
A Ramming Pulveriser.

Also, I hope I got the right end of the stick.

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Thx @JonahTheBard. Keep the good end of the stick and continue to make the world more beautiful!

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You did magnificent work, thank you so much for sharing it!

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Thx RedPython.

@EvilSmoothie & @AMD, I apologize because I answered without taking the time to study the case of titans. But finally I did it, and the weak point of the titans causes critical hits identical to the others (damage x2).

And thank you for spurring me! Because it highlighted new points:
:point_right: Titans have much more unbalanced stats than heroes (for example, Att~1020 and Def~420 for a 5* Demon Lord). Or, their damage is not calculated as for the heroes.
:point_right: Tiles can perform critical hits outside the weak spot.
:point_right: Powerful colors on the weak point make x4 damage.
:point_right: Critical hits on the weak point cancel out color weakness (for example, a green tile on the weak point of a red titan does x2 damage, not x2/2=x1 damage).

And here is a new job to do! I do not have enough data to check if this is also the case for all critical hits. Iā€™m going to run a red team on 8.7 to check this point.

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What Iā€™m really interested in is that do all hits really have 3% chance to crit? Iā€™va always thought you can only hit with certain troops.

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I want to thank you for the time and effort you put in thisā€¦ Itā€™s awesome and therefore you are awesome!!!

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Thx AMD.
@EvilSmoothie, still a very good questionā€¦ But I can not answer it!
After verification, all my critical hits appeared with troops having ā€˜criticalā€™.
With my new tests yesterday, it is more than 1300 tiles studied without any criticism outside troopsā€¦
This is not proof that it never happens, but for me itā€™s enough to conclude: do not count on!

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A really important finding is that the special attack % is multiplied at the beginning of the calculation. Ive always thought that the special attack was calculated using the base attack stat, as modified by buffs/ailments/troops, a damage figure calculated, and then the result multiplied by the special %. I was wrong. The special % goes in at the start, so it is amplified by the way the formula works.

This discovery explains a lotā€”why Grimm seems so much stronger than Tibby or, especially, Gormek. Hmm, hmm. Very interesting!

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Yes, it increases the stats differences. So, Grimmā€™s special skill is more devastating, but heā€™s also much more fragile.

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This formulas are great, Iā€™m playing now with them in attempt to generate hero grading sheet :slight_smile:
I prefer numbers to letters, and math to feeling :wink:

My current reference point is average def and attack of 4+5 stars.
Info that I get using that approach I think is good for wars and raids, where we have a hero against a hero situation.

But for titans, map or event bosses I think itā€™s too way off.
Do we have any data on anything of that? Like health points, def and attack percentage of titans, bosses?

I was trying to dig up that, but when I search for ā€˜titan defenseā€™ I see bunch of ā€˜help me build anti titan teamā€™ or similar posts, so, not helpfulā€¦

If anyone has some idea what else to add / compare in order to get better grading, shoot :slight_smile:

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If youā€™ll make it pubblic could you even add a specialā€™s resistance meter? (Def and HP vs snipers)

Ex.
Using a 4.80 Joonā€™s Solar Beam, said hero is likely to remain aroundā€¦ 73% of his hp? SR.73
Is he going to be dead? SR.00 :stuck_out_tongue:

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I must say that I canā€™t follow, maybe Iā€™m not proficient in terms? Can you elaborate request?

If I manage to do it and if it looks like it has some sense, making it public should not be a problem

Basically is a request to add how a hero is likely to survive to snipers, be it Joon or Lianna.

It could be useful to players who are trying to climb ladders to decide defensive heroesā€¦
A secondary ā€œStaminaā€ (to use 7DD sheetā€™s term) divided into survivability under tile damage and under sniperā€™s special skill

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For 8 star purple titan of 2200 000 health points, I got 420 for his def and around 1500 (by some hits it looks more like 1550 and by some like 1400, but I have mixed troops and I did color stacking ). That is just from one try. All points you noticed I can confirm, looks consistent.

If you gain something new on titan topic, please share :wink:

But, question of the day - if 5* and 8* star have same def, why itā€™s easier to smack a lower star titan with the same hero setup? :thinking:
Or put in other way - I have a feeling that when stars go up, my damage gets in half for a while, until I level some heroes and itā€™s not that pathetic.

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Subject to further check, what I think happens when you get a crit from a weak color is that:

  • the crit damage is calculated as normal (=basic damage)
  • the base damage is halved.

So you end up getting 1.5x damage when you crit with an off-color, vs. 2x when you crit with a neutral color.

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Dead heroes canā€™t deal well with titans : p

Iā€™m talking about pure tile damage and points scored. If I can get x points against 9star titan, when I get 8star titan I score much higherā€¦