Counterattack with shared dmg

This appears to be an issue with counterattack when shared dmg is activated.

Shown in the pic, I have Wilbur’s shared damage special activated, along with Elena’s counterattack.

The opponent’s Magni attacks Tarlak for 650 total damage which is distributed over my team, dealing 130 dmg to each hero.

Magni, considering Tarlak’s counterattack activation, only takes 115% of the 130 dmg, instead of the 650 total dmg.

For damage to be shared, it needs to be applied at one source first (Tarlak). The counterattack should be based on damage received (650) before its shared/dealt with the team. I believe the counterattack should be for 747 dmg on Magni, instead of 149 dmg.

Not really. Counter attack is based on actual damage received. If Tarlak only suffers 130, no reason to counter for the full thing.


Isn’t Magni attacking Tarlak?

Isn’t Magni doing 650 damage?

Yes but 650 to all. That’s Wilbur for you. You cannot have his ability while also wanting a full counter of Elena. That would be absolutely overpowered. You cannot counter for the damage that was not received.


it’s the way counterattack has always been.

If shared damage wasn’t activated, it would be Magni attacks Tarlak for 650 dmg (ignore buffs), Tarlak counterattacks for 747 dmg.

When shared damage is activated, nothing changes with the attack dynamics, other than received damage is shared with team. Magni still attacks Tarlak for 650 (ignore buffs). Tarlak is still the single point of received damage and should counterattack with what he’s hit with… that’s how it’s always been.

That’s what I meant. 650 is shared to all. So what is the problem with the mechanics. its to one hero and not all heroes so the reflect should only be the damage received by targeted hero.

Wilbur would be a monster already if his ability can enhance a shared total riposte damage.

Wilbur is not enhancing counterattack at all.

For a source to share damage, it needs to receive it.

Tarlak (the source) is RECEIVING 650 damage, but because of Wilbur’s share ability, 130 (650 / 5) damage is DEALT to everyone. Counterattack is calculated on the 115% received damage when Magni attacks Tarlak (or should be).

In fact, counterattack is weakened in this scenario.

So. I use Wilbur a lot, and there’s one thing that’s bothered me for ages: when he’s on a team with Boril, Sumitomo or Cyprian (to name a few), and they’re sharing damage with everyone they won’t return the damage if they’re not the ones being hit directly. This is super annoying as they take the damage, but nothing is sent back, and the hero card is very specific that it’s any damage receives that will be countered. After the latest update where all counterattacks got pretty nerfed (which was sort of fair - but that’s a different subject), I would at least expect SGG to also fix this bug. There’s no room for misinterpretation here. The cards are specific. So either the cards must be changed or the bug be fixed.
! Screenshot_20200302_195419_com.smallgiantgames.empires|241x500

Sadly, it’s not a bug but intended behaviour. Shared damage from spirit link (Wilbur, Aegir, Gunnar etc.) happens before the counterattack is calculated.

So using both type of heroes in one team is not good idea. But, you can take advantage of it when fighting riposte heroes - using Wilbur will minimise counterattacked damage. It’s still worse than dispelling it but it helps a lot.

There’s a lot of topics and discussion about it if interested, just use searching.

And counterattack was not nerfed in last update, it was bugged and they just reverted it back how it was always working.


Hmm, ok, I haven’t had a riposte hero who did it the old way - since I havent had one foe more than a couple of months.

However, the text regarding riposte/counterattacks is so specific it doesn’t matter. Damage taken is counterattacked. As long as it says that, and the counterattacking heroes receive damage, it must be sent back to the enemy. Its already lowered, of course, by the defense buff so its not a huge amount of damage in a way.
Of the top of my head I can’t remember if the damage is spread out among all heroes or not if eg Sumitomo is hit, and how much it strikes back of that damage.

You can check for example this thread, it has a picture of counterattack damage with Wilbur, it’s 1,5 year old and it’s still working the same way:

Very sad story… How a stupid behavior can get by ignorance accepted as a general rule.
I doubt it is intended. It’s just difficult to fix.

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That’s my exact thought.
Since I have a bit of an issue double checking it, but:
If Wilburs shared damage is activated and one or more of your team members have been struck by Athena or Kingston - will shared damage then increase those ailments, even if it’s a team member who’s hit but not directly those with the ailment? If that’s the case it will be exactly how the counterattacks should be dealt with. So either they have to nerf Athena and Kingston a little so that the only way of further debuffing defence/atk stat is by a direct hit to the hero affected, or fix how the damage received must be counterattacked.
And it should be really obvious that it ought to be the latter, given the text on the heroes who does counterattacks.
I don’t really care if they say its difficult or not. Either change the text to direct hit, or fix the issue!
The current situation is plain and simply stupid - and makes counterattacking heroes hopelessly unattractive, or Wilbur for that matter.

He, and his immediate allies only reflect the damage taken from a direct hit, and that is of course lowered because of the defense buff as well.
For better or worse we generally want a good healer paired up with a counterattacking hero with low defense and high health (like Elena) since the counterattack then becomes potentially fatal to the attacker.
Apparently it was a bug for a time where the damage score was what was calculated from for the the counterattack, not how much health was taken. Thus a near dead hero would counterattack with the whole shabang and not just the remaining health x counterattack %.
Theyve now fixed it so that it’s only the health taken x counterattack % that’s being sent back to the attacker. It does make sense that that’s how they do it, but then it’s also infuriating with the situation I’ve commented on earlier.
It makes all counterattacking heroes super unattractive to combine with Wilbur/Kailani etc. And if I’m not mistaken we’re getting the opposite effect from eg Athena and kingstons debuffs (that makes the debuff worse every time you’re taking damage).
Its an awful situation, and one that the devs ought to fix ASAP. :roll_eyes:

Yes same way it increases buffs of khiona or brienne

I’ve already been down the road this thread is going though, it wont be fixed and idk if it’s even a big enough deal to be fixed tbh. It’s not a mechanic that’ll make or break a match imo

Have fun

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He is correct though, the card should say direct damage and not just damage. That would make it clear that DOT’s and shared damage are not reflected.

There wouldn’t be that many threads, if it wouldn’t be important.

Reflect - match breaking. Up to 80% negated by shared damage. Not severe?
Black knights special - match breaking, ruined with shared damage. Not severe?
Healing from dmg dealt - not exactly match breaking, but basics for several heroes. Up to 80% reduced. Not important?

These were just 3 examples. None of them correspond to the ingame description.

If you’re losing matches because all 5 heroes don’t trigger riposte…can probably bet you’re not seeing the full picture as to why you lost the match.

But honestly forget it. This discussion just isn’t worth the time.

Been through this all before and actually this whole thread should be merged somehow if it hasn’t already


If you think this discussion is about me loosing, or about 5 heroes not triggering riposte, then indeed you waste your time here.