Class quest level 30 requirement

if you let people under level 30 I that’s exactly what will happen. complain upon complaint of how they wasted crafting items and world energy cause someone told them they did it with a lower level team.

it takes skill and planning to complete these trials especially with the limitations and people under level 30 should not be doing upper level tiers yet. heading to this leads to a bad trend and I won’t support that

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if I was 0 I wouldnt k ow anything about the game so a level Wall would be least of my concerns as learning what to do and what to focus on would be my first priority. it takes time to farm items and people using the “carpet bombing” strategy are simply proving they are not high enough level to be there. without crafting items the font finish the event and all of those can be bought so u push it back to p2w again which is what you claiming to avoid right?? I have e completed all trials with no crafting items and j dont have single 4 or 5 star capped. I show people and explain strategies to help them as they get there. so when they do they can do it without wasting items they will need for other events.

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Yes, I’m not a big spender at all like I said previously.
17€ per month, in 3 months, classifies me as a C2P, right?

Anyway…
I totally understand your point but I think that, if I was a P2W, I would buy WE flasks and loot tickets and get to lvl30 in 5 minutes, so I don’t think that taking away the wall would affect them.
They can buy the ‘trainers pack’ and try many pulls to get the best heroes to beat it…
Honestly I don’t think there’s any way to stop this kind of customers and I, like you and any other F2P or C2P, accepted it when we decided to play this game.

On the other hand, I like games where skill does count and I hoped that in this mobile game, in particular, it had some role beside money and luck in pulls/ascending mats.

you think skill doesn’t count here? that statement alone says why level 30 should be on the last stage of trials. if skill doesn’t count why are some people carpet bombing to win and some not? not always about levels of you dpnt have the right heroes or doubles do to trial guidelines its gonna take more than a fair amount of skill to win.

Let me try this again:

if you’ve already posted in this thread, take a break.

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That team would of been smashed soundly in the last stage, that im almost certain of, no heavy hitters and Balthazar would of head shot 3 of the 5 heroes you have.

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I have nothing new to add on the level requirement. What I will say is that I greatly appreciate the team power recommendation. Yes, it is high, but anyone who has played other trials, challenge events, quests, etc. knew to expect that. In other words, though inaccurate, it is still a useful guidepost. I actually wish these were more common; I would happily take note of them for the hard levels of season 2.

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There are few games in the world where luck influences as much as in this, luck is a high percentage and not only in the mats, as an example, yesterday I lay down on the 10th of the world, with almost 3000, that is to gain practically everything and, at a high level, it does not matter if you shoot, it only crosses you with 5 or 6. Well, I got up with 300 less and a chest to make, I lost 7 of 8 and I almost got a diamond. I’m not the 10 best in the world, nor am I bad to lose 2500 with my team, it’s pure luck. And that and the error of the stacking make these threads come out, that do not exist in any game, because they all limit.

I appreciate the measured posts provided by you here in this thread for sure.

The added information that this was hotly debated in beta also is informative.

Personally, I think SG got this one DEAD WRONG.

I imagine the rationale is financial in nature. That a big spending 10-20 level player will be willing to spend on emblems later on, so letting them farm them ‘for free’ earlier in their game doesn’t help SG profit off their work.

And most non spenders / C2P maybe wouldn’t have a strong enough team to tackle it until 30, so SG views this as a way to reduce incoming emblems for players who can’t use them yet anyway.

BUT, this does damage the ability of new players to ‘catch up’ in an obvious way.

It is unnecessary.

It is unprecedented, generally speaking. There are plenty of activities gated off by power restrictions, but very few past the first few weeks/(month?) of play that are hard stopped by level.

And seriously. What positive effect does this have on gameplay anyway? None.

I’m always going to land on the side of inclusivity towards new players. I think I’ve been pretty consistent in this since I first arrived.

And on this particular issue, it seems obvious and clear to me that SG is taking a step backward.

I don’t like the “well I earned it so they have to as well!” Logic either. This does nothing to promote an equitable battlefield and to help assimilate new players to the game.

In my opinion The negative effect to player morale of this poorly designed gateway are more damaging to the game as a whole than the sum of profits from the unearned emblems from low level whales.

It’s nice to have a place to discuss this sorta issue, but personally frustrating to see policies like this adopted by SG without knowing their rationale and seeing how it quite obviously would be frustrating to our newer players.

TLDR;
SG got this one wrong.

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explain to me how a brand new player to the game will be frustrated by seeing that the have a level requirement to do things as this is common in most games? help me see your logic

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@DoctorStrange at this point, I think debate is unlikely to change anyone’s mind. Probably best to just let those who haven’t yet had a say one way or the other get their chance to speak. Otherwise, I suspect the mods are just going to lock the thread.

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hey if he can make me understand how one level cap on one thing when there are tons of things that u need to level up for in this game that are way more frustrating like the length of time it take to get a TC20, then length of time it takes to get said heros from these TC,s, time it takes to even level any hero that can partake in quests, length of time to upgrade food, length of time it take to be able to craft really good usable items,…etc… but now this one thing,this one level requirement is such an issue? I dont understand how there is even a debate. I’m done here just one more player to avoid.

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I promise you, I (and I suspect most people) are very
clear that you disagree, and why you disagree. I’ve read your posts, and you’ve made some good points. I really appreciate that, because it’s good to get different perspectives to help think through an issue. But I’m also glad you’re going to let it rest now so that other people can have a say. Thank you.

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no problem brother your post are always informative as well. good luck to you In the game

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There’s a difference between a “brand new player” and a “new player.”

A level 20 player may be playing for 3-4 months… I’m not sure of the exact timeline for leveling, and of course it’s individualized, but at any rate it isn’t like they’re on day 1 or day 10 of playing. These are players who have a lot of playtime and possibly money invested, yet are still 2-4 months from reaching level 30. (It took me about 6 months to reach level 30, so I’m basing my numbers off that. Of course some people will arrive sooner, others later.)

Well, First, you’re kinda assuming that I’m in favor of those other ‘stops’ the game has built in. I’m not. One of my first, and angriest, posts was about the unnecessary difficulty of the monthly events to new players - to the point where a new player (a Brand new player in this case) can’t complete anything but the first level or two of a monthly event.

I don’t like it.

I’ve played a lot of games in my life, including RPGs like Earthbound or FFVII, adventure games like Fallout3, Dark Souls is an all time favorite. Deus ex. I love me some strategy games, AOE, Warcraft 2, etc.

Anyway, different games have different ways of gating off material so that the player feels a sense of ‘growth’ over time.

In some games areas are locked by “story progression.” In Earthbound you can’t go to the second city, Twoson, because the corrupt police in Onett have blocked off the path between the two towns. The third town, Threed, is blocked by ghosts and you need to discover a way to get past that.

RPGs lean on this mechanic frequently. Within a given area you are free to explore, generally, at your own will. There aren’t pop-ups saying “oh, sorry Cloud. You aren’t level 30, you can’t go there.” … there is writing, and reason or rhyme that doesn’t interrupt the game world and gaming experience that gates the players. It isn’t jarring, and the purpose is clear. (Moreso because IAP werent a thing, so no one would question the motives of a game developer. And devs similarly were not financially incentivized to create random arbitrary gates whose sole purpose is to increase profits.)

RTS/TBS generally introduce new units as you progress through a campaign. BUT the one comparable and sensible thing that crosses genres here is that buildings take time to construct. AND as buildings become more complex, they take more time to construct. This is reflected in the TC20 wait. Players are prepared for this, it follows logic and follows traditional gaming tropes.

Some adventure games are “open world” and some are linear. With open world the only limitations are where can you physically go without dying. There are areas you can venture into at significant risk earlier than maybe intended, with the game devs knowing you’ll almost surely die. Dark souls has this in spades. It’s a nice mechanic that helps with a sense of progression. SG utilizes this, you could argue, by allowing low level players to taste events before they can realistically complete more than a level or two of them. (Again, I don’t love that design, but that’s owing more to the way events exist within E&P versus possible rationale behind the decision… I think it makes perfect sense to “have it both ways” in events where there is a power neutral, lower reward tier tailored to new players. Monster Legends does this FWIW as far as contemporary games with such a model.)

And so, for most of the time-gate activities there is a clear reason WHY… Why can’t a new player make it to Season 2 maps? Well because they didn’t defeat the S1 map yet. It’ll take time, and more importantly, team power growth. The story requires it. It’s a solid design. And I have never seen a complaint about it.

Now same thing with leveling heroes, crafting items, researching, etc.

These are all acceptable gaming tropes hard baked into E&P. The PARTICULAR lengths may make some individuals balk, but that there are “gates” of this variety fits perfectly into the game world. It’s established that these are how things work in E&P.

SO

All of that as background for this random level 30 cap.

We don’t see it anywhere else in the game.

It doesn’t have a story explanation.

It doesn’t have a logical explanation (IMHO.).

It doesn’t have a gameplay explanation (events are much the same, right. No way almost all level 12 players can complete Legendary event, but they have access to it all the same.

It has, at most, a monetary explanation. SG thinks that a decent % of people in the 20-29 rank could complete the emblem quests. They think that that means they’re gonna get 2-3 months worth of emblems that they don’t need to let them have. And they need to monetize their work in implementing emblems, so giving them away free twice a week, to everyone, when they don’t have to isn’t necessary. That’s the best explanation I have.

And since this type of gate exists no where else, I’m forced to make that sort of explanation.

I don’t like it. It has a clear negative impact on the game, even if it is for a minority of the gamers, and I just can’t see how it makes sense.

God bless you if you make it through that wall of text. :heart:

Lastly;

I would be honored if you would avoid me.

But for real, I probably dislike you more for your opinion than you dislike me for mine.

If I have my way, it impacts a minority of players in a positive way.

If you have your way, it impacts the same people, but negatively.

Unfortunately I haven’t shown the capacity to avoid people that i disagree with. So if you keep this argument going I’m sure we can get this thread closed up real good like.

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we have different opinions and i asked you to explain yours so i could try and understand and you have I still dont agree but I wouldnt waste real gamers time getting a thread on something that some people seem to find important closed. good luck to you out there also and the voting shows my opinion is shared by others so that says enough.

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:roll_eyes:

The majority of people are neeeeevveeewerrrr wrong about anything.

And yes your opinion is shared. So is mine to some extent.

It’s both opinions so whatcha gonna do.

I’m pretty confident in my logic and reasoning

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that’s good if you were not it would make all of your paragraphs pointless. glad to here you stand behind yourself. felt like there was some good debate had out here today. hope to see you on another topic sometime, you actually have really well thought out responses and I understand your view I just simply dont agree. good day to you sir and good luck out there,we are in one of those mismatched wars again and my alliance needs me. good day to all

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In case it was missed, Kerridoc’s poll asked the following:

I note with interest that “keep it lvl 30” has nearly 3x the amount of the other two choices.

I also note with interest that there were only 27 votes.


Based on what I’ve read, I believe the thread has talked out all sides, yet not come to any conclusions. Should I not close the thread? :slight_smile:

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Probably safest. Otherwise someone is going to necro-post this back to the top of #general-discussion in 11 months.

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