Beginning results of an uneven matching in war

So far it has been a complete and utter massacrer. Our side only has 3 teams left standing. Not so fun when you really don’t have a fighting chance.

Can you provide some more data about the mismatch, please? What is their average defensive team strength, vs yours? Can you check their Alliance score (Titan and trophies)?

My guess is that you got paired up with a team full of people who chronically drop cups for easy hero boxes, or who brought in some players after the matching (perhaps because they had gone off mercing titans and returned later).

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They have a score of trophy 53990 and Titan 51263,a total of 105253. At the time of pairing they had 96778. We have a score of 95709. Their highest player before taking on mercs was 3700+, now there’s 6 of them at that level. Our highest member is at 3656.

Yeah, that’s going to pose a problem in the future, Unless there is a mechanic built in that doesn’t allow any movement in or out of the alliance once the matchup is set.

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You are absolutely right! This mechanism must exist. Matches like this can not happen. Our match is pretty much equal, and although we made lots of stupid decisions (ok for being first time) the score is pretty close

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It looks like another issue could be cup-dropping. If the matching is based on alliance score and an alliance collectively cup-drops they will be getting free wars.

I think there could be War-Score added. Let it add to the Alliance score, but match alliances in AWs solely based on the War-Score.

Sum up HP/team power/whatever of all 30 teams in an alliance to establish how much War Score winning vs. them is worth and much much losing vs. them is worth.

Do like 5 wars or w/e based on the current matching system so that alliances get more-or-less matched while gaining their War Score and then swap to matching based on that.

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That’s exactly how current #1 team got matched to #14 team 1st go round. Need better system to rank.

I think rewards should be light 1st 5 matches for alliance wars (win or lose) and then progressively better once true ranking is established. Perhaps a total count of 5* and 4* heroes for each alliance should also be transparent and count towards overall ranking, Alliance war record should be displayed next to each team and there should be a lock out on people switching alliances for wars. Much more I’m sure people on here can think of…

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My alt’s alliance has this exact problem - the matching is clearly based on alliance score, which crazy given that:

  1. cups totally flucuate and many still intentionally drop cups
  2. titan score is more about having a core 6-9 strong heroes than it is about bench strength.

They REALLY REALLY REALLY need to do what @Revelate suggested and sum the total power of each player in the alliance’s top 30 heroes and match aggregate alliance totals. This is totally simple to code (basic boolean logic and summation) and would alleviate using one metric that is being gamed and another that doesn’t correlate super well to matching strength in AW.

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Not sure what you mean Dori - 7DD is the #1 ranked alliance and we were matched with the then #2 alliance HHR on Wednesday. Today we were matched with Shadow Warriors, currently the #2 alliance.

Matching in the top 10-20 is pretty simple, it’s the further down you get where you will see much larger disparities between alliance ranking and bench strength.

Shadow warriors were #1 earlier today. They matched with #13 last round - Russian alliance (клан медного чайника).

A pure alliance score matching selection method is likely to show some odd results. I was lurking in the general chat for a bit before I got bored with the inanity today while someone was boasting about his alliance’s score. I found it amusing that with an ‘alliance’ consisting only of myself, I had an alliance score over double that of the boaster’s own alliance.
Matching solely on score isn’t going to work out very well I fear.

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On Tuesday when the prep time started and raids were matched, 7DD was #1 and HRR was #2. Shadow warriors was further down the list then (aggressive was #3, etc). Now a few days later, Shadow warriors increased their cups and 7DDwas #1 and they were #2 when it was matched yesterday.

There are various alliances that don’t enforce a cup floor and many members leave to merc or intentionally drop cups for ham raiding. They bounce up and down 10-15 spots in a couple of days.

Yap. That’s exactly what happened. Unfortunately, with so much random movement just in top 20, imagine how random matches beyond would get…

Lots of ways to fix this, including having members designate 30 heroes they will use (maybe similar to favorite button… make a warrior button), then calculate total hero power for the team and let fairly even matchups happen.

That’s on the right track, but there’s no need to do it manually; all the hero information is in the database. When time comes for matching, just add up each person’s top 30, sum for the alliance, and then match on that score. Easy, dynamic.

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This post is meant as feedback. It was a great idea to have an alliance war and, of course, over time, it will get tweeked here and there to adjust this kind of “problems”.

The other problem I’m seeing with matching on alliance score is for alliances that merc, if there’s half your alliance out mercing when the prep time starts and matching is done, when those other folks come back in, you’re going to decimate the opponent.

So IF (big if) they’re going to keep the alliance score as matching criteria, they HAVE to not allow anyone not in the alliance when prep time starts to participate. Otherwise merc’ing alliances are getting matched waaaay down from where they should be AND people will start gaming the system dropping half their members right before the prep time and then re-joining after match.

OR the obvious solution to all of that is to sum each players top 30 hero power and match alliance aggregates.

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Isn’t it a ‘1st world problem’ to worry about #1 alliance being matched to #13 alliance? I’m really surprised that there is so much variance in strength at that level that such a match might seem one sided.

To me it sounds a lot of fun that the pool is so small at the top that repeat match ups are entirely likely, adds a lot more theory and strategizing to the mix. That’s never gonna happen at mid levels.

I see some worry now though in exploiting the matching if cups are used in the calculation. It would be easy to get 10 or so members to leave an alliance during the matching process and rejoin once the remainder are matched against a weaker team, so there may need to be a block that you cannot participate in the current battle if you were not n the alliance when the match was done.

( edit - overlapped with Dantes post)

Agree that this is the best way of matching.

The operation you suggest, while (theoretically) simple to code, may take time or a lot of resource to execute as it needs to address every player record. I guess it would depend on their DB design and indexing as to how expensive an operation this proves to be. (If the design is good, it should be doable, but still non-trivial.).

An alternative is to collate and store an ‘AW’ score per player that calculates by the client app whenever there is a change / level-up of a hero. This spreads the computation to all the individual players’ clients, and is a trivial calculation to have to do at that level. The job of calculating matching would then just use the already collated ‘AW’ score per user account and would not need to perform this calculation from first principles several million times (# of players) on each matching run. This would make it a lot more viable if the centralised calculation from first principles is impractical.

The other thing that really needs addressing is to freeze AW participating team after matching. (In the thread below @Elpis made the sensible suggestion of moving the matching to be much closer to the start of the war, and freeze participation as matching is done. This would obviously require the matching process to be sufficiently efficient / quick to be able to do close to start time.

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Maybe 1st world problem, but if you compare top 30 heroes of top 3 alliances to those of top 10, you would be surprised at the amount of disparity. It’s a complete mismatch. I’m one of the top guys in my alliance and chronically in top 100. About 5 people in my alliance could comfortable be in top 3 alliances, but a huge drop of in total number of heroes from there on down. Top 3, most have strong teams x4 (we r talking 20x 5*, or fully developed 4*) and a lot are close to complete set of 30. I have some guys who barely have 1 strong team. No competition.

That’s what i said in another topic, for the high tier guys, war is fun but for the guys that are mid tier and low it’s a wrecking ball… They are always dead and cannot kill anyone!!!

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