Analysis: Value of chests and items

Yea, @barrywuzhere that would be greatly appreciated. Particularly about your experience receiving data from other users! (good/bad experiences, what you would suggest for that, etc)

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But wouldn’t emblems expand a c2p player roster strength more than a p2p?

I mean i believe you can fully emblem like 3 or 4 4* at the cost of 1 5*

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Right, but everybody have emblems, so while you upgrade your depth, you still lack upside, which is (at least to me) the most important part of all. I mean, to be in a better alliance or hit higher level titans, you eventually start needing 5* heroes, and better if emblemed!
Just as an example, when hitting 12* and 13* titans, I already feel like my 4* are overwhelmed, so more emblems do not change my upside as much as receiving new and better 5* heroes (let’s say challenge heroes, a HOTM or a good TC20 like magni, joon, marjana, etc).
But that is just one point of view, and some other players hitting lower titans may prefer just to have a broader team. There is no right answer here hahah, I just feel like sometimes increasing upside is better, or having more heroes with more synergy, rather than more nodes in heroes that lack synergy or are just not that scary!

Good discussion, phone is dying, will revisit later

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I’ve got a couple thoughts.

  1. Gem valuation will vary between players. I suggest primarily tracking quantity of various things, as that is the raw data … and if you have a good average value, it is easy to convert at any rate.

  2. There have been a few attempts to collect chest data and elemental chest frequency, and if you can find others and combine your data with any of them, you will get better results. These two come to mind:

  • 7DD had a chest tracking spreadsheet that allowed all kinds of chests; someone might have some data you can get. (Dunno if it is active or not)

  • @Guvnor has a titan loot data collection project. It’s data is formatted a lot more like yours than my farming data.

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I 100% agree that the per gem value is easy to set up as a variable and manipulate. That’s actually what I did since I track the drops I posted about in Excel anyway. I plugged in your values first and posted that result, then changed the values to something closer to what I thought (not thinking about it too deeply) just to see how it changed.

But, I am mortified that I made a HUGE error in my post from yesterday. Basically, I was wrong about a deal that was offered in the holiday calendar. I’ve edited my post, but here’s the relevant part (corrected):

  • I think you undervalue emblems. The shop often has deals where you get 10 emblems for 175 gems. 17.5 is much higher than the value of 5 you plugged in! Another way of looking at this may be looking at other deals. During events we can buy 200 gems for $1. Let’s say we did that ten times: 2,000 gems for $10. What else can we get for $10? During seasonal events we have seen 500 gem and 100 emblem deals, implying 15 gems per emblem (also fairly in line with the regular shop deal). Another seasonal deal is $10 for 1000 gems and a four star AM, implying a value of 1000 gems for a 4* AM.

This makes more sense anyway, as I had wondered yesterday why one of the offers implied such a low gem value for emblems.

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Emblems

I strongly disagree.

Some heroes are good, some suck, most are just okay.

But some are really really good. Many people level 2x to 6x copies ( looking at you purple 4* Rigard )

Even with 5* heroes, with emblems, on some of my families accounts, Rigard 4*+18, Melendor 4*+18, 1x to 2x Grimm 4*+18, Wu Kong 4*+18, Boldtusk 4*+18, Proteus 4*+18, Tiburtus 4*+18, Sabina 4*+18, Scarlett 4*+18, Cyprian 4*+18, Kiril 4*+18, Boril 4*+18, are insanely powerful heroes.

Emblems was the best thing Devs did for all players, F2P to P2P.

“The hero you have is better than the hero you do not have”- F2P wisdom.

Beta beat

This does not include some good 3* / 4* heroes showing up in Beat Beat Season 3 heroes.

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The number of 5* heroes that significanly improve titan hits is small, and hard to get.

The high end buffers ( Tarlak, Miki, Ranvir ), the elemenal debuffers ( Panther, Frida, Evelyn, King Arthur ), the general debuffers ( Athena ).

It is usually better to use color stacking. Many 4*+18 heroes have better attack stats than 5* 4.80

Notes

Click for notes

Basic Color stacking

Color stacking

Color stacking, Empires hidden buff

Neutral color stacking

FIN

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I concur with your strong disagreement. For F2P, you can’t count on having/maxing a ton of 5-stars, and even fewer 5-stars that you can max out on emblems. My best is currently Domitia +9. However, I have a ton of +20 four-star heroes that are quite sturdy, allowing me to compete in diamond tier. So yeah, I’ll emblem Domitia, Poseidon, and Onatel for my defense team, but I’ll also happily go to battle with my Melendor, Sabina, Tiburtus, Boldtusk, Kiril, and Sonya +20s. A recent post by Olmor claims that a fully emblemed Little John (HP/def) is viable for diamond raiding; I’m working toward it to test that theory. Would really help my ability to stack green.

Indeed. Confucius say…

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I agree with some of your points, but I guess we are just disagreeing in the overall long term philosophy. I am more about upside so that is why I do not value emblems “as much” and a little more tokens. I still have emblemed 4* and find them useful, but for me the priority is trying to find ways to get 5* start heroes, at least for now!
Once I get more of them, of course my mind will shift more to getting emblems, but as of now, to improve my roster upside I need more 5* heroes.
Just as an example, having high end 4* I still lose more raid than when using non emblemed 5* just because they are more strong (usually abilities).
Anyway, a good discussion and disagreement is always welcomed! helps to see new options and point of views. I always strive to get more emblems, but right now I am chasing token and heroes more.
Well, I will keep you informed about the future mechanism to provide data, so this project can grow!

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Been there, so I understand. I’ve been fortunate that my legendary draws have been mostly good ones - Onatel, Poseidon, Ranvir, Domitia, Azlar, Vivica, Sartana, Thorne, Khagan, and Elena. If I were sitting on a bunch of Horghalls and Obakans, maybe I’d feel differently.

Hi guys, first leg of this data project is available now!! Elemental Chest loot project

Please help if possible!

If some of you are still interested in this, I update results from my dataset:

Now that some people have started to receive costume keys, I am starting a new dataset once I get my first key (not including that chest so I do not bias results).
With that the main idea is to check if things change (i.e. reduction in other drops to compensate as example). If everything seems equal, both datasets will be merged.
Hope this helps the decision making of people.

At least it helped mine, I never go without doing 4 chests everyday, and on lvling days I fill a third of raiding!!

If some of you want to look at elemental chests and help with that project you are also welcome!
Elemental chest loot project

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Hey Again! Also CTP, wanted to share the offer calculator values I use (the first grayed out column is “Equivalent Gems” to compare to your values). A lot of these values I found were based off the relative rarity of the item compared to EHT and ETT loot drops across all sources (chests, titans, wards, etc) on the basis of a 10 pull.

This is incomplete but relative rankings of best value offers:

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Very good, I actually like it, and seems to be fairly accurate in how most C2P should value those offers.
Now, guys with several 5* (higher end c2p or p2p players) may want to value more the 4* AM as they already have good heroes to use them, but a severe lack of 4* AM

Hiya!

I have a couple questions about the value you’ve assigned to some things:

  1. Wouldn’t token summons be equivalent in value to the summon they offer? I.e. one hero summon = 300 gem saving. One costume key = 350/5 gem saving etc…?

  2. Raid and world energy flasks are both valued at 100 gems in the shop…?

  3. Similarly, most battle items are available in the shop for values greater than what your sheet has them listed at?

Things are worth what people will pay for them based upon the relative supply and demand. Just because SGG charges 150 gems for a 1x daily summon should mean 150 gems is the worth of a gray summon token? Nobody would pay that! (omg, I hope nobody pays 150 gems for a daily summon…) Same with axes, flasks and junk in the shop. You get free ones regularly so they’re not generally worth that much to people except in unusual situations. Like you have a billion dollars. Or you will get first place in the challenge event ending in three minutes if you just had five more axes…?

In short…the relative values I assigned are my own opinion. I didn’t completely make things up either as I did try to use a 10-pull on summons as the gem equivalent basis to estimate the worth of other items in accordance with their “free” drop ratio compared to EHT/ETTs. Most mid-to-late-game players who are spending are likely saving for at least a 10-pull at events instead of single pulls. I just adjusted things based upon how I darn well felt about them :wink: not to speak for ierazo, but he (or she) used a similar approach. Some data + some opinion.

Correction: The costume key value I have is not correct with recent updates. 60 gems equivalent per Costume key would match Atlantis coin values. It may be adjusted slightly downward if costume keys start appearing in free loot drops everywhere.

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P.S. You know those little “330% Value!” stickers SGG places on their offers? I call shenanigans on those.

Its actually accurate based on the value of items in shops etc…

Hi Guv, I have a similar stance to Dorkus, in the sense thata s a C2P I will never pay the amount of gems they ask for some of the things… therefore I have my own valuation system (posted above). That is a good thing of the community, we have a lot of different opinions that help to see other points of view!
My valuation is actually a couple of posts above with the rationale behind it explained

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