Alliance Wars Poll - The Revenge Concept (Take 2)

General Discussion
1

SG has pleased me greatly in showing themselves to be agile in their approach to alliance wars and to consider community feedback and make changes in response to it. This is very encouraging.

As a result, I feel that the topic of the Revenge concept is proving controversial and divides opinions. There has been another poll on it, and while informative, I would like another go to focus more precisely on the direction that we as a community would like to take it.

So… please vote on your thoughts for the future of the Revenge concept in Alliance Wars. If you vote option 4 then please post your ideas for the revised mechanic below for consideration / discussion. I will post my own opinions only after I’ve seen the poll has some traction.

  • Keep it as it is
  • Keep the same mechanic, but tweak to make it weaker
  • Keep the same mechanic, but tweak to make it stronger
  • Keep the concept, but change the mechanic
  • Get rid of it entirely

0 voters

13 Likes
2

I fixed the title. :wink: I’ll hold off on the poll until such time as I actually get some play experience with AW.

1 Like
3

I find the revenge barrage of arrows very distracting.
I wanna fight the enemy Heroes not a bunch of arrows hammering down on me.

4 Likes
4

I like it for the sole reason that it lets me field an entirely different defence team based on damage mitigation and survivability rather than a more standard raid type defence team.

The one thing I dislike as an attacker is the increasing speed as the defence team becomes smaller, so I’d tweak it in that way.

4 Likes
5

:rofl: Oops. Thanks @Paulon

6

Ok… 25 Votes in I think I can safely now post my position without adding bias to the initial post.

I voted option #4.
After reading the debate in other threads both pro, and against, I’ve settled on the idea that it has a place in the war and does adds something new that differentiates it from regular raids, but the current mechanic has too much influence on strategy and narrows your choices, and retards the ‘fun’ part, (which is the actual fight with the enemy combatants) by artificially shortening it. I see its place, however, to level the playing field between the weaker defenders and stronger attackers, and to take some of the advantage of the attacking team away in order to encourage more team work in the alliance to coordinate attacks. I certainly get that.

So my thought is to slightly change the mechanic to vary the strength (and hence influence) of the revenge concept based on the team strength differential between attacker and defender on an individual encounter.

Basically, if defender has higher team strength than attacker, Revenge either doesn’t fire at all, or fires for a minimal amount. If weaker, then the wider the gap between defender and attacker, the more influence the revenge bar has (up to a point, of course).

So how does this help?
It gives you more options on defence. With a static influence of revenge (as is the case) your defence strategy is biased towards heal and defend pretty much across the board. With a variable influence, however, your stronger teams may opt for different build-ups because they would not be able to rely on the arrows doing the majority of their damage against players of similar strength to them.

It offers the attacker more tactical richness. You can opt to take on stronger teams by whittling them down with revenge being less of a factor, and maybe then switch to the weaker teams when your bench options become fewer. Or you can take out weaker teams with your stronger (living with the revenge bar) for the quick win in points. Basically you have some choice in tailoring your opponent to your particular opinion about the revenge bar.

1 Like
7

It’s making interesting reading so far with the first 38 voters.

Reasonably surprised to see the highest single vote being the ‘Get Rid’ option in light of the 1st poll… but majority (60%) do want to keep (so far). The keep contingent are almost evenly divided as to whether it needs tweaking or keeping as is.

8

Right now, get rid of it entirely is the highest vote. Do they not see what you see, that the revenge bar is to help fill the gap between the haves and have nots with the big line-ups? :wink:

1 Like
9

I was initially fully in the ‘get rid’ camp, but have since seen the light and can now see its purpose (although I prefer to tweak as stated above).

It’s a bit like the British Brexit vote, however.
You think you are dealing with a straight ‘get rid’ versus ‘keep’… but actually the ‘keep’ is quite nuanced and can itself divide opinions.

So the comfortable majority (62%) are now on a ‘keep’, but really opinion still very evenly divided between keep as is or tweak.

The Brexit vote operated in a similar way. The ‘Leave’ vote won by a small margin, but the actual vote within the leave camp is really divided between the different outcomes they would prefer with a ‘leave’. So even the group that agree don’t really agree.

Such is life.

1 Like
10

NP. We’ve all probably been hit by the auto-corrupt function at some point.
The original title wasn’t actually too inappropriate, if you consider the concept of throwing ideas at a wall and seeing what sticks.
Edit: typo fix.

11

The revenge bar needs to stay in some form. If I lose because of the revenge bar, then I was probably losing anyway.

12

I beg to differ.

Today - and not for the first time - I won a raid with just 2 heroes being barely alive.
Last man standing on the opponent’s side, health half full, two guys barely standing on mine.
Ghosting tiles, being careful not to hit this guy, mana-ing up those two heroes - and bam! :slight_smile:

I particularly enjoyed this win today, because I have had exceedingly bad boards in raids for the last 3 days. Or, as I call it, “Hit attacker Anja squarely in the face and drive her off” - time :wink:

Of course, with some revenge bar annihilating my barely alive heroes, such feats are completely impossible.

But in normal raids, it ain’t over till it’s over. :wink:

edit:
In normal raids, I also reach that tie-break mark quite a number of times.

3 Likes
13

Hi Rook,
If you have 5x 2* fighters up against a single 5* opponent,
you don’t need a barrage of arrows cutting you down like Sunday’s lawn to even things out.
The single 5* Hero is more than capable of smashing 5 week opponents to smithereens & then
clicking his knuckles when he’s done with em.

14

Let’s reverse that: you have five 5* attackers, and your opponent—due to being new to the game—has only 3*.

The revenge bar cuts down everyone. I think that was the point. :wink:

2 Likes
15

“Touche” :disappointed_relieved:

16

Yes, the Revenge bar is an ultimate pain in the butt… thats the point!
In AW you’re CHOOSING your targets, which makes the playing field completely lopsided for mixed power alliances. My alliance contains an ecletic hodgepodge of veterans and newbies… The newbies were all targeted multiple times as they were “easy pickings”
…but my defense (sabina,perseus,delilah,zeline,natalya) was never even targeted…
The idea that your team of heroes is attacking a fortified position and therefore at a disadvantage makes perfect sense.
With all that said, a fortified position could provide other forms of aid… an advancing attacker could have tar dumped on them, or is facing an enemy with adaquete medical supplies…
so if the mechanic must be changed to appease the masses, have a rng effect with the following specials:
1 arrow attack (25% damage)
2 blinding flash (6 turns -34% accuracy to attack team)
3 tar (-34 attack 6 turns)
4 miracle (raise a dead defender)
5 rally (defenders get +30 atk/def 5 rounds)
6 heal (50% healing/dispell debuffs)…

Or something like that…

3 Likes
17

Or we could continue with a hail of arrows every time… :grin:

(I like your creativity!)

3 Likes
18

Looks like a late surge in ‘keepers’ is swinging it. :slight_smile:

I’m really with @AnjaValkyrie on this one. I think it denies me more interesting encounters. Sure you could argue we have raids for that, but then again with raids you don’t have the dynamic of needing to switch up your teams constantly from a reducing pool of heroes (which I like… makes it interesting).

Now after scraping together the best hodgepodge band of 3* you have left you get them wiped off the map with arrows and don’t really get much of a battle out of it. I really think there are cleverer ways to impose balance.

Let’s see how she runs, but suspect it will keep moving in the direction it’s currently going.

1 Like
19

Well yes, thank you.

When I attack in raids, I usually rely on making battles last. Because I have to.

I raid in the 2400 - 2600 cups range, attacking only opponents with more or equal cups.
Now, the only 5* fast mana single shooter that I have is Joon. No Magni, no Marjana, no Sartana, no Hel, no Lianna.

Thus, going against those guys and gals, I have to keep my heroes alive long enough to get their specials off. Or I am dead.

I bring Alberich and one more healer, in my attack team. Joon, and two more shooters. Strong color against the tank, if possible.

If I can make the battle last, take out the tank and ghost some tiles in the open slot, to mana up my heroes, then I have a good chance of winning. If I cannot, then I am dead.

Oh.
I just realized why I absolutely refuse to attack opponents of my strength in AW.
Because … with my heroes … I do not have an ice cube’s chance in h***.

I am not knocking my heroes. I love my heroes.
They are great for titans, missions, rare quests, events and raids. Because in raids, I know what to do, to compensate for the lack of fast mana single shooters.

But for AW, my heroes suck. And there is no way to compensate. Cannot even ghost tiles.

Aha. No wonder I detest AW. Because I have no chance against strong players.

…

Sorry for all this OT.

I will continue to do my duty for my alliance.
But now, at least, I have realized just why I am not good in AW. And why I could never attack another strong player in AW. Players with all kinds of fast mana single shooters might get some shots fired. Players without them are up the creek without a paddle.

6 Likes
20

Case in point:
one raid of just now.

Battle:
opponent:
2600+ cups
4129 team power

attacker(me):
2400+ cups
3874 team power with that attacking team (2 blue heroes, Arthur at 3/70)

I won. Won 40 cups ( Started with 2400+ cups, because I had some visitors last night who drank my beer and carried off the cups that it came in :slight_smile: )

This victory would have been impossible with that barrage of arrows in my face.

Thus, I find it slightly tiring to read, again and again, laments that stronger players attack weaker players in AW. Slightly insinuating that these stronger players are cowards and should be forced to attack those of similar strength.

BS. Going on suicide missions is simply not sensible.

Screenshot_20180312-164150
Screenshot_20180312-1641501080×1920 924 KB

(I am not having you on. I also have a screenshot of the victory. But it may not be nice to post this here)

Be that as it may, I will not shy away from doing my duty to my alliance. And no, they do not expect me to accomplish such feats with that barrage of arrows in my face.

5 Likes