ALLIANCE WARS....... Frustrating, Boring & definately unrewarding

#233

I still have a few unleveled 3s. Need them to make 30 but focused on 4/5s.
We definitely get beat the 2nd half of war. Score **usually ** pretty close until then.
Would be a help to compare roster strength ,since that’s how were matched, when picking opponents.

#234

Aleph Null is boycotting the upcoming alliance war. You should too.

#235

Seven Days Fermented is a bit of corner case because it is so much stronger than most alliances with the same amount of members. There simply are no other alliances of the same size that are good enough to fight them. We’ve tested allowing bigger differences in member counts, but that results in more uneven matches for most of the alliances.

As I said in a different post, July is a bit challenging month because so many of us (including me) are on vacation. We are still testing things, but can’t make bigger changes. I was really hoping we could have made a more measurable improvement before that.

Things we have been working on right now:

  • Further AB tests using the current logic
  • Fix for the alliance level opt-out

Things hopefully released early August:

  • Personal opt-out support
  • Smaller iterations to the current logic

Things we are discussing:

  • Implement ELO ranking which was the long term plan anyway. As I said elsewhere, we still needed some heuristic to seed the rank, and that’s why we started with what we have.
  • Various bigger changes to the current logic, possibly still combined with ELO ranking.
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Alliance Wars Matchmaking (Discussion & Developer Response)
#236

Thanks for the update @mhalttu. This has got to be as frustrating for you as it is for us.

#237

Thanks for taking time to answer. My original question still stands regarding a description of logic being used so that we can better explain to our alliance. Majority of members are 90 days or so into game. So we get slaughtered after 1st round as heroes only get weaker as it goes.
This is why I asked for an easy to understand explanation particularly regarding each players 30 heroes.
Since we only see posted defense strength, its very hard to agree that these 2nd half blow out matches are selected to be fairly matched.
Thanks again.

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#238

Can someone clarify ELO for me, please?

Then I can add it to the Fictionary :wink:

https://forum.smallgiantgames.com/t/the-e-p-jargon-pulverising-fictionary/30695

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#239

It’s a comparitive scoring system. Raiding trophies already use it.

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#240

Thanks. Very prompt :blush:

#241

It’s been posted elsewhere but to summarize: we calculate the team power of the top 30 heroes of a player and sum them together. We give extra weight to the top five heroes with the simplistic assumption that they will be used as the defense team. Then we sum those numbers together for every member of the alliance. That’s it.

If you tell the name of your alliance and the date of the absolute worst match you’ve had, I can check it out later in case it offers some new insight to us.

4 Likes
#242

Sure…anything that helps…will pull our history and forward.

#244

If in 9 months you can’t get a team at 3000 you are playing wrong or don’t play a lot. I made a 3000 team in 40 days as f2p.

Se em 9 meses você não conseguiu um time em 3000, ou joga pouco ou joga errado. Em 40 dias fiz o meu primeiro time em 3000 sem gastar nada.

#245

Looks like today will be the worst yet. Usually can still be somewhat close until regen.

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#247

because I need to get out heroes I give you a yellow example the best I have and Bane and red and Nashgar who are heroes of 3 stars, then I had to wait 3 months to ascend Rigard and 2 to ascend zeline and Grimm So do not miracles friend, wars do not give a thing.

#248

Thanks… i hope our group of misfits can be of use to testing your algorithms.

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#249

As someone who has played other game with ELO rankings intensely (League, Hearthstone, Gwent, etc.) I would love to see a similar system in E&P. I already wrote a topic about this, so am very happy to see that you had planned it from the start.

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#250

I agree. Improving team power estimates should help with AW mismatches. More information and examples on this can be found here:

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#251

In my alliance we lose about 85% of the Wars but if you can’t beat them kinda join them lol we still make it hard for the other teams to win but we mostly use it for training really new members on titans, like practice for the titan really. During war They get a feel for the game more, war & how to strategize their teams to use more wisely for when battling the titan. If they win great if not no stress :sunglasses:.

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#252

@mhalttu, my alliance has been getting consistently bad very bad matches, and I’ve mentioned it to you in prior topics, I know. At first, we were a very new alliance, and were way tougher than our titan score from baby titans, and we slaughtered pretty much everybody. Then came the new matching systems after that, and they have been similarly uneven against us.

The last couple matches have all been against alliances were many players were ~10 levels higher than we were, most of our members being level 28~35, and many of them being players in their 40s. I think we are getting matched with seriously stronger alliances because we have a significant number of p2w players who have paid to summon a good selection of 4* and 5* heroes, but haven’t played long enough to level up most of them…and we are getting matched to alliances with mostly players who either have played long enough to have 30 well leveled heroes, or ones who are getting their 4* and 5* heroes slowly enough that nearly every one they have is leveled up, either to max, or to an ascension barrier.

Please refer to this topic, and see why this is a problem–many of our heroes have a team power that is (effectively) hitting way above their weight class. Team power is misleading across star levels

By September when you’re back to working on matching, I suspect that many of our members will be growing into their rosters, and we will be more-or-less grown past this problem, but I’m sure it will impact other alliances too; I’m less upset about losing than I am about badly uneven matches, which aren’t much fun for either side.

3 Likes
#253

While I agree on the unleveled hero power issue, maybe it is to prevent people from backlogging fodder heroes & power leveling a hero once matching has started. Granted, this would only work for one war, so… maybe it’s just an oversight :slight_smile:

P.S. - We have been getting mismatched often, too.

#254

@mhalttu
Alliance name: Don’t run! I have candy
We are also experiencing bad matchups. Latest one vs BABY METAL probably being the worst. We have been able to win some when we had good activity vs enemies bad activity, but they have still been bad matchups.
I suspect the problem bein that we have couple experienced players with lot of newer ones. Usually the enemy has consistently better teams than our newer player, so much so that the players with big rosters can’t help enough when it comes to our defenses being crushed.