No. You misunderstand. Rerolls don’t really cost anything beyond minimal food. Here you lose a turn. You just don’t get an X towards eliminating you from the tourney.
Without the retreat button, let’s assume the player knows his team well enough to know that he was unlikely to win one of the first two retreats. Without the button, she’s on the hook for 75 gems OR she’s done playing altogether.
With RETREAT - they get numerous extra hero kills to fill their Hero Chest, and score in the top 50 percent with the extra points made rather than the bottom 75 per cent if they’d lost out on Day 2.
Scores might be:
Day 1
554 - Win
560 - Win
120 (loss) - first X towards elimination
332 (loss) XX
530 - Win
Day 2
539 - Win
548 - Win
551 - Win
231 - (loss) XXX
RETREAT - (chooses not to take the fight, drops a bit in rankings so next enemy defence is less strong, scores 0 or other minimal point total, enemy defence credited with a win), but critically does not get an X and stays in the game
Day 3
518 - WIN
RETREAT. <— point at which, without RETREAT, player would have been done or owe 75gems
509 - Win
RETREAT
RETREAT
Why is it always that I don’t seem to understand things.
I understand perfectly., lol
It is ANOTHER FORM of rerolling even if an actual reroll isn’t involved just to make it sound different you have added a cost factor to it but the bottom line is.
you get to refuse an opponent
you get to not lose points for retreating or a forfeit. Whether there is a reroll or not.
you want to retreat without consequences other than a cost factor.
I think that pretty much sums it up.
The fact that a cost is involved does take away the fact that you are either running away or forfeiting your match which in either case would resolve in a loss against you.
As real life senarios are used here quite often lets use a couple here.
in any match whether it be chess, tennis, football, you name it, if a team forfeits a match they lose that match.
They don’t get no points for no playing, they get deducted points.
if your in the middle of a war or match for that matter and you choose to stop playing for any reason what so ever or run away you lose that match automatically.
even if no new opponents are chosen as you say and your just retreating then as retreats go you lose points.
Only under extreme circumstances will each team be awarded equal or no points if the umpires themselves or judges call the match off for what ever reason, but there will usually be a rematch with those same 2 teams.
So it doesn’t matter how you word it or what costs you put against it in any way shape or form you are talking about retreating from a battle plain and simple whether it be before or during the fact the result is and means the same and thus you shoukd lose points.
No one retreats from a game without consequences thus ours here is a X .
Now did I understand it correctly or did I miss out a point here., lol.
This random mess as you all call it (and I am not disagreeing with you on that score) but just choose to accept it whilst they are looking for was to combat it.
This will in my opinion always be a mess because unlike in normal raids where the matching is done using cups the torni has no starting point to determine player strength or level.
Based on the fact that torni’s are so different each time I am not even sure that setting up something like torni cups woukd solve the problem either.
So then it becomes more a war like matching system which I feel could work if say the top 5 heros in the given class allocated for that particular torni was used as the bases for the match making.
It is no longer based on the defense team you pick, but your best heroes that match the tournament requirements. We’ve brought this rule back because we want to encourage players to choose the best defense team they can, and thus provide a better challenge to their opponents. Due to the way the Team Power is calculated it was possible, for example, to pick a defense team of two fully leveled, fully ascended heroes that were on paper equal in Team Power with a full team of lower rarity heroes, but in practice that full team would be defeated in most cases.
Well I guess in such a torni which will have so many different chances with each one it might be harder than we think for them to create a close to perfect matching, give them time and they will work something out I’m sure, in the mean time just enjoy what we have.
It may be (this may sound confusing) that they might have to allocate a different/seperate matching system for each torni type and run each one in cycles instead of just different torni’s within a single matching anagram.
You can’t say “except for the consequences there are no consequences” - that makes no sense.
And I’m not sure you understand sports… if you don’t play a game, you fail to gain points - you don’t have points taken away. Again, just counter factual.
But in a real world battle the enemy that retreats yields territory but preserves its fighting strength. There is a cost, but there is a benefit.
Bottom line it’s not crazy to propose a tweak that permits players to play the game they want to play.
And finally, I said you didn’t understand because you said its a reroll. You’re convinced of that, but it’s not. It is qualitatively and substantively different in that you forfeit both points and a turn. You get a loss - just not a strike.
There’s the wrong assumption. Point of a game is to sell. In phone games especially the point is to make the players invested in the game. They do this by restricting play time so you have to return and invest more time in the game.
Anyone who doesn’t make it to the reward is unworthy of it?
Sports is not a single thing, so I don’t know what you’re referring to, but from the sports I know, not playing is the same or worse as losing the game. You don’t get points and you’re marked as loser. In this tournament, you don’t get many points for losing and the X marks you as loser.
That’s a wrong parallel. In real life tournament, when you refuse to fight your opponent, they get the win and you get the loss with all the conveniences of a loss.
I understand why you’re against buyins but it’s not that much of an advantage to a player to pay for continuing in the tournament while it is a great advantage to the game developers to have the players pay to continue when they should have been eliminated
I could see a different solution, though . Instead of the Xs, anyone, who’s at the bottom 25 of the remaining players would get eliminated after the end of the day. And for the pay to win players they could keep the option of paying gems to finish the day or if they’re eliminated, paying gems to return to the pool
What is a lose if it’s not a strike against you. Makes no sense.
Your asking to be able to treat without consequence.
Even if the opponent gets the win which he should, for there to be a winner, there had to be a loser thus a X fir having retreated, fortified, what ever you want to call it.
Yes they preserve their fighting strengths as you say but they do not gain territory at all as they retreated thus admitted defeat and ran away. The opponent wins both the battle and territory.
Actually as a soccer player if we forfeit a game we lose it automatically whether that involves actual points or not is irrelevant but it is still a X against your team, thus the case in this game.
As a chess player if I choose to retreat, run away or stop playing for any reason I lose the game thus a X agsinst my name as is the X cross here.
It really doesn’t matter hiw you want to look at it or word it or make it sound right, retreating, forfeiting, running away it all means exactly the same thing YOU LOSE the match and thus get a cross against your name.
There is nothing that can be said to change that fact or anything that justifies it to be anything else.
Everyone gets rewards, if you are saying that the unworty ones are the ones who doesn’t reach 1% loot I have to remind you that:
different points are awarded for different assigned defenses
you don’t have control on the defense you will face
RNG could not be nice to you and you could find your nemesis teams scattered across the week as well as in the first 4 flags.
RNG starting board and cascades aren’t in your control. Weekly raid’s rules make so that we drastically require better starting boards to win over your average defense.
So as I can see even the “worthy” ones you could be talking about would just have been blessed by RNG, so everyone should or shouldn’t be called worthy.
I was talking about a general tournament mechanics. Only the winner gets the hand of a princess, no matter if everyone else was better than him on paper.
In real life, there are thousands of circumstances that could stack against you and you don’t get to win even when you should. The referee doesn’t grant you the goal, the enemy team gets a lucky winning shot two second before the end of match… I’m not saying that there shouldn’t be attempts to make matches fair, but the winner is always a person with the best combination of skill and luck.
You are now making it sound as a monthly event, where only one players get the top reward.
This isn’t real life so I wouldn’t try to seek arguments in that regard but this is a tournament.
Skill and luck. The luck factor should be reduced and this topic’s suggestion could help in that regard.
You’re team is scheduled for a match vs an out of town team near the end of the seasons (baseball, football, soccer - you pick)… the weather turns sour, it’s lightning. The other coach doesn’t care about the safety of his players and is willing to play. Your coach isn’t going to take a chance, he holds his team back.
Show me a league where “points get deducted”… just one. I can wait.
@Halifax, what you are discribing now is a fluke and not ‘normal competition’.
I don’t know what to tell you anymore to try and make you take a step back and try to see things with some distance.
I appriciate your idea, and the fact you are defending it but please try to stay open for other suggestions as wel.
Name a league where under any reasonable circumstances you “are deducted points” for choosing not to play a match? In My local bowling league sometimes teams miss games - people work, travel, have family commitments. You lose the game, but you’re team doesn’t lose points in the standings.
The point I’m countering was one used to suggest the Retreat option doesn’t make sense because of real world examples… and yet when real world examples are brought up that don’t fit, they are dismissed.
I can see the opposing argument and suggested it’s based on an overtly stated premise that is demonstrably false.
Perhaps you can see it from my perspective - I’d rather not have a reasonable suggestion dismissed based on make believe pseudo-facts.
I don’t know where you are from but all the competitions I know here in Europe have the rule: no show is a loss and win for opponent.
Personally I do not mind if there is some way to skip an opponent but personally I do not think that should be without some sort of penalty.
As stated before: a tournament (the way I see it) should be to prove yourself against others, stronger, weaker or somehwat equal strength). This will be the same for everybody at some point in the tournament.
This is a part of the game you play (seriously, hardcore, casual I don’t mind) that you enter for free to see how well you can perform and adept to challenges. Sometimes you win them and in other times you will lose.
If it would be very equally made, only players with all hero’s fully levelled will win and go to the top, now a lot more people have chances to end up in top xx%.
That is ~exactly~ what my proposal is. Once a player hits “retreat” they score a loss, the opponent gets a win, and the retreating player sacrifices one of the 5 attacks on the day - the benefit is ‘no elimination x’
. Instead of the Xs, anyone, who’s at the bottom 25 of the remaining players would get eliminated after the end of the day. And for the pay to win players they could keep the option of paying gems to finish the day or if they’re eliminated, paying gems to return to the pool
